Interested in Astronomy as a Freshman

[mezzo-piano]

TL;DR: How can I begin to gain an understanding of astronomy?

Hello there, and thank you in advance to anyone that might answer this. I'm sorry if this is the wrong place to post a question like this, as I am new to this website and also very nervous about making a post that others might see/reply to.

I am a freshman in high school and I am interested in astronomy. I want to learn about space, but I am not quite sure where to begin. Is there anything that I can do to seriously expand my understanding of space at my level, both in and outside of school? Are there any classes that I can or should take? What can I do to work towards a space-related career from where I am right now?

I am honestly very nervous to pursue something like this and try to learn about it. I have always found math difficult, so I worry that I would fall behind in a class like Physics. Is it possible to be successful even if math isn't quite my forte? I am also autistic, and tend to become overwhelmed with my school work (maybe that is part of the reason why I struggle with math). Often, I feel like things are moving too fast for me to grasp them, and it is a lot, so, many times my priorities have shifted from genuine understanding to simply passing a class because of how stressful it can get. Thus, I worry for my capability to even understand something this complicated. Even so, I still want to try, I'm just at a loss for what to do. I guess I'm just anxious over it. I'm afraid that someone like me shouldn't try to understand astronomy. Is there anything that I can do to help myself succeed or not fall behind? Is it possible to succeed even with something like autism making it more difficult to?

Apologies if my questions are too vague or if this was hard to follow. I love space and have been fascinated by it since I was little, but I have always been nervous about seriously pursuing a career related to it. I would love to know what I could do right now to improve my learning and knowledge.

Thanks,
Ed

 

[jedishrfu]

Dear @mezzo-piano,

Where there is a will, there is a way. To prepare for your journey, you must overcome your math anxiety.

The best analogy here is that without the proper musical training, you want to play the Flight of the Bumblebee like Yuja Wang (she is awesome):



If you want to succeed, you must develop your math sense; there is no other way to really understand Astronomy and Astrophysics without it.

It was once said that only 10% if the Astronomy majors ever get a job in Astronomy. Here's the latest Indeed job postings for astronomy majors:

https://www.indeed.com/career-advice/finding-a-job/jobs-for-astronomy-majors

There are a lot of related fields that capitalize on the skills you learn in Astronomy, like math, programming, writing, and communication, and jobs that require analytical skills, like a patent agent.

If you're okay with that, then you'll need to focus on your math. There are many fields of math, but Astronomy majors study the following ones:

• Required core
• Calculus I–III (single- and multivariable)
• Linear algebra
• Ordinary differential equations (ODEs)

• Strongly recommended
• Partial differential equations (PDEs)
• Numerical analysis
• Scientific computing
• Data & uncertainty
• Probability theory
• Statistics

• Only if needed / just-in-time
• Complex analysis
• Dynamical systems
• Optimization
• Stochastic processes
• Machine learning / data science

• Usually skip unless specializing
• Abstract algebra
• Topology
• Measure theory
• Functional analysis
• Logic / foundations

I'll stop here for now.

Jedi

 

[symbolipoint]

I am a freshman in high school and I am interested in astronomy. I want to learn about space, but I am not quite sure where to begin. Is there anything that I can do to seriously expand my understanding of space at my level, both in and outside of school? Are there any classes that I can or should take? What can I do to work towards a space-related career from where I am right now?

( I did not read everything else yet. )
Early in highschool is a good setting to start.

Ninth and Tenth graders would, I am guessing, go through an "Earth Science" course and Astronomy is included. Also the time is right for opportunity for the typical "College Preparatory" set of courses, including Algebra, Geometry, and some Trigonometry. Engineering kind of direction would also be a good way to go. Too much more to say,...,. Experiences with Photography? Beginning familiarity in using telescopes?

 

[jedishrfu]

There's an excellent math website called

Www.mathIsPower4u.com

It's a vast collection of videos from middle school to first year college. Each video is about 10 minutes long and focused on a specific problem in the selected course.

The problem is stated and the teacher works thru the problem. It's very visual with less of the fanciness of Khan Academy which by the way is also good to check out.

One further point, taking notes while good is not sufficient. You must do active learning where you continuously test yourself.

As an example, you watch a video problem statement and stop it right there. Now from memory write down the problem yourself and make a real attempt to solve. Take notes on what stopped you and why.

If after 5 or 10 minutes you feel you’ve a brick wall then watch a little of the video, stop and try again. You will make it thru step by step. Keep track of your progress and where you went astray.

A lot of students take the easy hit or miss way, watching the video, taking notes and moving on. But if you ask them to teach how to solve the problem are stopped in their tracks.

Another strategy students use is to strengthen what they already know, believing that they will be able bash thru a course. But if course, they only learned the easy stuff.

An analogy here, in WW2 bombers would go out on a mission and come back with holes from shrapnel and bullets. The mechanics would patch up and reinforce those areas that got shot up.

However, they were still suffering terrible losses in bombers until a mathematician said wait.

Spoiler

These bombers made it home because they were shot in areas that didn't affect the planes chances of flying home.

What was the answer?

Spoiler

Add more plating to the areas that were unhit like around the motors or fuel tanks or cockpit. The planes that never returned got hit in those places and it's why we lost them.

How would you approach this problem?

Spoiler

You have bombers that came back and you can map their damage to get an idea of the density of shrapnel. Look at the damaged parts and then the undamaged areas and what's behind them.

It takes some insight to see the true cause and to convince others to change their ways.

Maybe you can team up with some like minded friends to teach and test each other though this can be distracting.

Personally, I would do my homework while watching TV and it took me twice as long and that was a missed opportunity. Today games hold the same distraction and you must overcome it as well until you find a study scheme that works and you can see the results.

I stumbled across all me if these ideas through laziness. I didn't take notes in math. I would just listen. My friend who did well in social studies, floundered in math.

He took down everything the teacher said and wrote. It was tough to use notes to take down blackboard solutions because the teacher would write something and then go back and erase it to make more room. You just can't take notes fast enough.

Bottom line, test yourself as you study. If you can't reconstruct what you learned, if you can't teach it to your dog then you haven't learned it. It's the only way to become a formidable math heavyweight.

 

[CrysPhys]

I am a freshman in high school and I am interested in astronomy. I want to learn about space, but I am not quite sure where to begin. Is there anything that I can do to seriously expand my understanding of space at my level, both in and outside of school? Are there any classes that I can or should take? What can I do to work towards a space-related career from where I am right now?

I am honestly very nervous to pursue something like this and try to learn about it. I have always found math difficult, so I worry that I would fall behind in a class like Physics. Is it possible to be successful even if math isn't quite my forte?

Where there is a will, there is a way. To prepare for your journey, you must overcome your math anxiety.

Too much more to say,...,. Experiences with Photography? Beginning familiarity in using telescopes?

OP: Although I agree that a good grasp of math is essential should you choose to pursue astronomy, at your current stage (freshman in high school), I would recommend that you get some actual hands-on experience to see what excites you. Do you have a telescope or access to a telescope (it doesn't have to be scientific grade)? Or even binoculars? One with an adapter for a digital camera would be great, but not essential. Is there an astronomy club at your high school? Where you live, is there a science museum with a planetarium?

Do you get excited at following (and recording, with the right equipment) the phases of the moon? Can you identify various planets and constellations (in the actual night sky, not on a sheet of paper)? Are you amazed by lunar eclipses and solar eclipses? Other celestial phenomena? Is your curiosity sufficiently piqued that you want to learn details of why these phenomena occur? You need some underlying passion (a word often overused and mis-used, but appropriate here) to motivate you to study, e.g., celestial mechanics and to slog through the requisite math (even if the requisite math per se doesn't excite you).

 

[mezzo-piano]

OP: Although I agree that a good grasp of math is essential should you choose to pursue astronomy, at your current stage (freshman in high school), I would recommend that you get some actual hands-on experience to see what excites you. Do you have a telescope or access to a telescope (it doesn't have to be scientific grade)? Or even binoculars? One with an adapter for a digital camera would be great, but not essential. Is there an astronomy club at your high school? Where you live, is there a science museum with a planetarium?

Do you get excited at following (and recording, with the right equipment) the phases of the moon? Can you identify various planets and constellations (in the actual night sky, not on a sheet of paper)? Are you amazed by lunar eclipses and solar eclipses? Other celestial phenomena? Is your curiosity sufficiently piqued that you want to learn details of why these phenomena occur? You need some underlying passion (a word often overused and mis-used, but appropriate here) to motivate you to study, e.g., celestial mechanics and to slog through the requisite math (even if the requisite math per se doesn't excite you).

There is a level of passion there for me that makes me want to get serious and learn more, to the point that I do want to conquer my nervousness regarding math to do so, I'm just not exactly sure how to.

I frequently go out to look at the sky, and with (probably not the most high quality) apps on my phone, I've been slowly learning where things are and how to identify them, at least on a very simple/basic level. But it excites me when I see something I recognize. I get genuinely hyped when my favorite constellations pass where I can see them and I'm always pestering my parents to come outside with me and observe the things that I find exciting (most recently, a conjunction of Pollux and the moon). Gemini and Castor and Pollux are probably actually some of my favorite things to see in the sky, the story behind the constellation and its stars really warms my heart and I get excited to see them whenever I can, although my parents don't seem to be quite as enthusiastic as I am when I'm hurrying outside to snap a photo because I think it's cool that I can see it from where I am.

The vastness of everything is also extremely appealing to me, thinking about how much is out there. Often, I find myself feeling mesmerized by what I can see when I can go outside and just stare at the night sky. It makes me want to understand the what's and why's of all of it. It's just so cool that all of that exists. It might sound silly because I haven't really gotten involved in the technical side of things, but that's the best way that I can put it into words right now.

I just feel a lot of wonder thinking about all of these things. That, at least, motivates me to want to understand it on a deeper level. I do like it when my parents drive us down to visit the science center, but it is honestly a bit of a drive from where we are and admission is paid, so they can't always afford to take me places like that. That being said, I am perfectly happy with the things that I can see from my backyard because I find that in itself fun and exciting.

I'm sorry if that didn't make much sense, and thank you for the reply.

 

[mezzo-piano]

There's an excellent math website called

Www.mathIsPower4u.com

It's a vast collection of videos from middle school to first year college. Each video is about 10 minutes long and focused on a specific problem in the selected course.

The problem is stated and the teacher works thru the problem. It's very visual with less of the fanciness of Khan Academy which by the way is also good to check out.

One further point, taking notes while good is not sufficient. You must do active learning where you continuously test yourself.

As an example, you watch a video problem statement and stop it right there. Now from memory write down the problem yourself and make a real attempt to solve. Take notes on what stopped you and why.

If after 5 or 10 minutes you feel you’ve a brick wall then watch a little of the video, stop and try again. You will make it thru step by step. Keep track of your progress and where you went astray.

A lot of students take the easy hit or miss way, watching the video, taking notes and moving on. But if you ask them to teach how to solve the problem are stopped in their tracks.

Another strategy students use is to strengthen what they already know, believing that they will be able bash thru a course. But of course, they only learned the easy stuff.

An analogy here, in WW2 bombers would go out on a mission and come back with holes from shrapnel and bullets. The mechanics would patch up and reinforce those areas that got shot up.

However, they were still suffering terrible losses in bombers until a mathematician said wait.

Spoiler

These bombers made it home because they were shot in areas that didn't affect the planes chances of flying home.

What was the answer?

Spoiler

Add more plating to the areas that were unhit like around the motors or fuel tanks or cockpit. The planes that never returned got hit in those places and it's why we lost them.

How would you approach this problem?

Spoiler

You have bombers that came back and you can map their damage to get an idea of the density of shrapnel. Look at the damaged parts and then the undamaged areas and what's behind them.

It takes some insight to see the true cause and to convince others to change their ways.

Maybe you can team up with some like minded friends to teach and test each other though this can be distracting.

Personally, I would do my homework while watching TV and it took me twice as long and that was a missed opportunity. Today games hold the same distraction and you must overcome it as well until you find a study scheme that works and you can see the results.

I stumbled across these ideas through laziness. I didn't take notes in math. I would just listen. My friend who did well in social studies, floundered in math.

He took down everything the teacher said and wrote. It was tough to take down blackboard solutions because the teacher would write something and then go back and erase it to make more room. You just can't take notes fast enough.

Bottom line, test yourself as you study. If you can't reconstruct what you learned, if you can't teach it to your dog then you haven't learned it. It's the only way to become a formidable math heavyweight.

Thank you for your very detailed replies. I sincerely appreciate all of the information you've given me. I never thought about studying math in this way. I felt like I was going to be in over my head since I have honors algebra starting after winter break, but reading all of this has made me feel like it's possible for me to find a way to study hard and better understand things, especially with the resources you mentioned/linked (and now I can even share some of this stuff with my friends who are also going into honors!). Thanks again for taking the time to reply to my post, I feel more motivated now to begin working on tackling my math problems.

 

[Choppy]

You're a freshman in high school and you're interested in astronomy... that's awesome.

At this stage, this isn't the kind of thing that should be making you anxious. What's important is that you explore the options that are available to you. Read. Join a local astronomy club. Start a journal that details all the cool stuff that you see from your backyard. Save up money for a decent telescope.

Try not to let subjects in high school intimidate you. Sure, they might be challenging and you might have to put in extra work, but that's not a reason to avoid them. Talk with your teachers and guidance councillors, let them know what you're passionate about. They can help you develop good study habits and strategies that will help you improve in the subjects you're interested in.

 

[jedishrfu]

There's a funny astronomy story I once heard about the English pop singer Katie Melua. She sang a beautiful romantic song called "Nine Million Bicycles in Beijing" that referenced the age of the universe.

There are nine million bicycles in Beijing
That's a fact
It's a thing we can't deny
Like the fact that I will love you 'til I die

We are 12 billion light-years from the edge
That's a guess
No one can ever say it's true
But I know that I will always be with you

I'm warmed by the fire of your love every day
So don't call me a liar, just believe everything that I say

There are six billion people in the world, more or less
And it makes me feel quite small
But you're the one I love the most of all

We're high on the wire with the world in our sight
And I'll never tire of the love that you give me every night

There are nine million bicycles in Beijing
That's a fact
It's a thing we can't deny
Like the fact that I will love you 'til I die

And there are nine million bicycles in Beijing
And you know that I will love you 'til I die

A popular science presenter, Simon Singh pointed it out, and an embarrassed Katie said she had once been a member of her school's astronomy club. So they fixed it in a parody kind of way.

The original verse by Katie Melua in the original version of Nine Million Bicycles

We are 12 billion light years from the edge
That’s a guess
No one can ever say it’s true
But I know that I will always be with you.

The new, more scientifically accurate verse by Simon Singh

We are 13.7 billion light years from the edge of the observable universe
That’s a good estimate with well defined error bars
Scientists say it’s true, but acknowledge that it may be refined
And with the available information, I predict that I will always be with you.

https://www.symmetrymagazine.org/ar...was Katie Melua,her blossoming long-term love.

 

[CrysPhys]

I'm sorry if that didn't make much sense, and thank you for the reply.

Your reply did make a lot of sense. I'm glad you wrote a backstory with concrete details. This bodes well for you. Too often we have students here who claim to have a passion for X; but when I ask them what triggerred that passion, all I get is some vague, abstract answer.

If your high school doesn't have an astronomy club, why don't you start one? You can get a science teacher to mentor you, and you can start a fund drive to purchase a telescope.

 

[mezzo-piano]

Your reply did make a lot of sense. I'm glad you wrote a backstory with concrete details. This bodes well for you. Too often we have students here who claim to have a passion for X; but when I ask them what triggerred that passion, all I get is some vague, abstract answer.

If your high school doesn't have an astronomy club, why don't you start one? You can get a science teacher to mentor you, and you can start a fund drive to purchase a telescope.

Thank you for the suggestions! My school doesn't have an astronomy club as far as I know, but that actually sounds quite fun.

Where you live, is there a science museum with a planetarium?

Since you had mentioned that earlier, it got me thinking, and I asked my parents if we could go any time soon—they said yes! I'm extra happy now.

 

[jedishrfu]

Even better would be to find an observatory near you.

Major Research & Historic Observatories in California

Palomar Observatory: Near San Diego, famous for the 200-inch Hale Telescope, crucial for 20th-century astrophysics.

Mount Wilson Observatory: Near Los Angeles, home to early large telescopes, important in establishing the universe's scale.

Lick Observatory: Located on Mt. Hamilton, east of San Jose, a historic university observatory.

Major Nevada Observatories

• Great Basin Observatory (GBO): Located in Great Basin National Park, this is the only research-grade observatory in a U.S. National Park, leveraging extremely dark skies for exoplanet and binary star research, with limited public access during special events.
• Jack C. Davis Observatory (JCDO): At Western Nevada College (WNC) in Carson City, it offers regular public stargazing nights, lectures, and classes, featuring interior and exterior telescopes for viewing planets and sunspots.

For Public Stargazing & Education in Utah:

• Stellar Vista Observatory (Kanab): A non-profit focused on public experiences, tourism, and science education in Southern Utah's dark skies, as seen on Stellar Vista Observatory's website.
• University of Utah Observatories: Offers public events at their new Willard L. Eccles Observatory (near Milford) and their South Physics Observatory in Salt Lake, as noted by Visit Utah and the University of Utah Physics Department.
• Salt Lake Astronomical Society (SLAS): Hosts public "star parties" at the family-friendly Stansbury Park Observatory Complex, found on their website.

Other Nevada Astronomy Sites & Resources

• Dark Sky Parks: Great Basin National Park is a prime spot for stargazing, and rangers offer astronomy programs.
• Amateur Astronomy: Groups like the Astronomical Society of Nevada use dark sites like Black Rock Desert and Cathedral Gorge for observing.

 

[jedishrfu]

And 10 famous observatories on the West Coast

https://www.latimes.com/travel/la-trw-telescope15mar11-story.html

• Mount Wilson Observatory — San Gabriel Mountains; public tours daily (Apr–Nov); 60-inch telescope by reservation; groups ≤25; $800–$1,500.
• Big Bear Solar Observatory — Island solar observatory; heat-stable viewing; new 1.6-m telescope pending; $2 donation.
• Griffith Observatory — Los Angeles; free public viewing; Zeiss 12-inch refractor; world’s most-used telescope.
• Lowell Observatory — Flagstaff, AZ; historic site; 24-inch refractor; summer evenings; $6 adults.
• Lick Observatory — Mount Hamilton, CA; summer Friday lottery; 36-inch refractor & 40-inch reflector.
• Kitt Peak National Observatory — Near Tucson, AZ; largest telescope collection; limited public scopes; nightly programs; $34–$39.
• McDonald Observatory — West Texas dark skies; star parties Tue/Fri/Sat; 22-inch reflector & 16-inch refractor; $10.
• Mount Graham International Observatory — Safford, AZ; Discovery Park; free exhibits; 20-inch telescope Saturdays only.
• Jack C. Davis Observatory — Carson City, NV; high-tech telescopes with live video; Saturdays after dark; free.
• Goldendale Observatory — Goldendale, WA; volunteer-run; 24.5-inch Cassegrain; Apr–Oct public sessions.

 

[Muu9]

See if you can find a used copy of "The Cosmic Perspective" or "Conceptual Physics". Bookfinder.com scrapes a bunch of sites to find the cheapest copies.

 

[CrysPhys]

Where you live, is there a science museum with a planetarium?

I do like it when my parents drive us down to visit the science center, but it is honestly a bit of a drive from where we are and admission is paid, so they can't always afford to take me places like that.

Since you had mentioned that earlier, it got me thinking, and I asked my parents if we could go any time soon—they said yes! I'm extra happy now.

Since you're too young to drive, you are dependent on your parents for transportation; so there's not much you can do about that. But BTW, is public transportation an option?

As for costs, look into various options:

* My town library has free museum passes (including a pass to a major science center ~30 mi away) that can be checked out.

* Science centers also often have membership programs that can be more economical than pay-as-you-go rates (depending on how often you go) and that offer you access to special programs.

* Lastly, science centers also often have volunteer programs: in exchange for minimum volunteer hours, you get free admission and access to special programs. Check with your science center for minimum age requirements (at my closest science center it's 16). And since transportation is an issue for you, check whether there is volunteer work that can be done remotely (e.g., sorting and curating digital files).

Before your next trip, try to arrange a meeting with one of the science center's staff members to discuss your interests and find out what opportunities might be available (there might be some flexibility to deviate from what's posted on the website; doesn't hurt to ask). Good luck on your journey!

 

[CrysPhys]

A popular science presenter, Simon Singh pointed it out, and an embarrassed Katie said she had once been a member of her school's astronomy club. So they fixed it in a parody kind of way.

The original verse by Katie Melua in the original version of Nine Million Bicycles

We are 12 billion light years from the edge
...

The new, more scientifically accurate verse by Simon Singh

We are 13.7 billion light years from the edge of the observable universe
...

12 vs 13.7? That's not too far off. Early this year, I became friends with a college student who is majoring in math. I told her that I'm a retired physicist. Turns out she has several friends who are specializing in astrophysics. She told me that the most irksome pet-peeve she has with her astrophysics pals is that they use π ≈ 10. I'm thinking of getting her a T-shirt emblazoned with π ≠ 10.

 

[Muu9]

The original verse by Katie Melua in the original version of Nine Million Bicycles

We are 12 billion light years from the edge
...

The new, more scientifically accurate verse by Simon Singh

We are 13.7 billion light years from the edge of the observable universe
...

12 vs 13.7? That's not too far off. Early this year, I became friends with a college student who is majoring in math. I told her that I'm a retired physicist. Turns out she has several friends who are specializing in astrophysics. She told me that the most irksome pet-peeve she has with her astrophysics pals is that they use π ≈ 10. I'm thinking of getting her a T-shirt emblazoned with π ≠ 10.

And it's so close to 10^0.5, too.

 

[jedishrfu]

You guys missed the point. Her number was off by 1.7 billion years and she went on to sing no one can ever say it's true.

Simon felt that her lyrics insulted all the hard work that scientists went through to get that number and continue to go through to further refine it.

 

[CrysPhys]

You guys missed the point. Her number was off by 1.7 billion years and she went on to sing no one can ever say it's true.

Simon felt that her lyrics insulted all the hard work that scientists went through to get that number and continue to go through to further refine it.

Picky, picky. It's stuff like this that make physicists such hot-in-demand party companions.

 

[MidgetDwarf]

I think anything is possible, within reason, if you put in the work.

I dropped out during 9th grade, never receiving more than a C from K-12. Fast forward, got my GED at 21, and went to CC at 23. Decided to major in mathematis since I did not like writing papers, and chose the major with the least amount of writing.

While at CC, I placed in arithmetic, math 105 for those familiar with the LACCD system. I did not know how to add fractions at this point.

Had to take 13 math classes before I could transfer.

Math 105,115,125,121,trig,precal,cal 1 2 and 3,
ode, la, and discrete mathematics.

Eventually, I got a BS in Mathematics (pure) and 4 classes short from a double BS in Physics, while working 30 to 40 hours a week.

I ended at MS Mathematics.

So I think anything is possible. As long as you are willing to do the work.

Things you can do right now:

Ask questions in class, maybe teacher has office hours or there is an afterschool tutoring program. Read assigned textbooks and try to do a little bit more than what the classes are asking for. In the summer, attend summer school.

 

[jedishrfu]

Thats awesome. I can relate to working as an undergrad. I worked at a dept store as a sweeper/maint in the evenings to a small appliances salesman working 20 hours per weekday and 10 hours on weekends.

I started out on minimum wage $1.75 got a raise to $1.85 and minimum wage was increased to $1.85 and I was back at the beginning.

In contrast, my younger brother did something similar but worked for a supermarket and got $4.50 an hour while doing less hours.

It was tough doing upper level physics. The prof would say my homework was excellent but it was a few days late and lost a letter grade. Classes met on Monday and Friday. He would assign hw on monday and surprise surprise would more problems all due on monday. With free time only on the weekend, i just couldnt finish.

Bottomline, don’t work outside when going to school focus on your studies, take short breaks and only do fun stuff when your hw is done. No kidding.

The end.