Is it the protons or electrons that are responsible for an element's propert

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around the question of whether protons or electrons are responsible for an element's physical and chemical properties. Participants explore the roles of these subatomic particles in determining various properties of elements, including both chemical reactivity and physical characteristics such as boiling and melting points.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Exploratory

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants argue that electrons are primarily responsible for chemical properties and bonding, while physical properties are also influenced by the number of protons.
  • One participant suggests that protons determine the identity of an element and thus indirectly affect its properties, but emphasizes that electrons play a significant role in chemical reactivity.
  • Another participant questions the validity of the original test question, suggesting that removing a proton from an atom would change its properties, indicating that protons do have a role in determining these properties.
  • Some participants express frustration with the question itself, labeling it as poorly constructed and suggesting it fails to capture the complexity of atomic interactions.
  • There is a discussion about isotopes of hydrogen, noting that most hydrogen atoms do not contain neutrons, which leads to further exploration of how isotopes might affect properties.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally disagree on the extent to which protons and electrons contribute to an element's properties. There is no consensus on the original question posed, with multiple competing views remaining on the roles of protons and electrons.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight the complexity of atomic structure and interactions, noting that the relationship between protons, electrons, and properties is not straightforward. There are unresolved assumptions regarding the definitions of "properties" and how they relate to changes in subatomic structure.

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[SOLVED] Is it the protons or electrons that are responsible for an element's propert

On a chemistry test I took, there was a question that asked "What subatomic particle is responsible for an element's physical and chemical properties"?
I picked the "proton" as the answer choice, but the teacher's answer is "electron"

I do not see why her answer is correct, not saying that I'm right. I understand that the electron, valence electrons respectively, are responsible for chemical reactivity. But what about physical? Since the number of protons also determine the number of electrons, the protons should be considered when it comes to elements physical and chemical properties. Physical, besides appearance, would be like boiling point and melting point and how can those properties be based on the number of electrons? the electrons are only responsible for chemical reactivity, right? If you know any sources, please cite them...
Thanks
 
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electrons are responsible for bonding.
therefore, boiling point, melting point, etc. are determined by the electron.
 
Chemistry, really is all about the study of the outer electrons of an atom.
The proton merely is a signature for an element. i.e it determines number of electrons in an electrically neutral atom
Obviously if it is a huge element with lots of nucleons, then the physical properties will be inherently different (although the electrons still play a significant role), but the electrons are responsible for the chemical properties.
 
Modernization said:
On a chemistry test I took, there was a question that asked "What subatomic particle is responsible for an element's physical and chemical properties"?
I picked the "proton" as the answer choice, but the teacher's answer is "electron"

I do not see why her answer is correct, not saying that I'm right. I understand that the electron, valence electrons respectively, are responsible for chemical reactivity. But what about physical? Since the number of protons also determine the number of electrons, the protons should be considered when it comes to elements physical and chemical properties. Physical, besides appearance, would be like boiling point and melting point and how can those properties be based on the number of electrons? the electrons are only responsible for chemical reactivity, right? If you know any sources, please cite them...
Thanks

That is a common question and the common answer is "electron"; but, actually, it's not a deep one. If you want to make your teacher feel uncomfortable, ask him/her: "So, if I remove a proton from an hydrogen's atom, I still have an atom with the same physical and chemical properties?" :wink:
 
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This is a terrible question. There ought to be a good way to prevent this horror from being inflicted upon more students.
 
lightarrow said:
That is a common question and the common answer is "electron"; but, actually, it's not a deep one. If you want to make your teacher feel uncomfortable, ask him/her: "So, if I remove a proton from an hydrogen's atom, I still have an atom with the same physical and chemical properties?" :wink:

No, does it even exist, actually?
if it only has 1 neutron in the nucleus, then there will be no electronic attraction to the electrons, then either the ionization energy of that is VERY low, or even non existent, or is probably is somewhere else right now.

If you remove a proton from say, Calcium, then it SHOULD change some properties. Since there is less electronic attraction to the electrons, so...
 
The H-atom has no neutrons.

If you pull a proton out of Calcium, you get K- (the number of neutrons matches). The latter is super reactive and will reduce anything within a mile of it.
 
I guess that when they say "properties", it means a specific element. Since changing the number of protons (typically) changes the element, that doesn't satisfy the question.

It still is quite a terrible question, though.
 
sephirothrr said:
I guess that when they say "properties", it means a specific element. Since changing the number of protons (typically) changes the element, that doesn't satisfy the question.

It still is quite a terrible question, though.
Yes, it's terrible the same because the physical and chemical properties of an atom are given by the atom as a whole: the electrons's orbitals are not created by electrons only, but from the interaction nucleus-electrons.
 
  • #10
Gokul43201 said:
The H-atom has no neutrons.

I did not know that. So in the molecule H2 there is no neutrons present, only 2 protons and 2 electrons?
 
  • #11
In a Pure Hydrogen Sample, MOST of the hydrogen will have no neutrons.
Then there are isotopes.
Deuterium and Tritium are isotopes, and they increase 1 and 2 neutrons respectively.
 
  • #12
Chilodonella said:
I did not know that. So in the molecule H2 there is no neutrons present, only 2 protons and 2 electrons?
Yes; is it surprising for you?
Certainly, as Invictious said, in a normal (that is, non prepared) sample of hydrogen, there are all the three isotopes: H2, D2, T2, but H2 is the greater percent: 99.985%; D2 is 0.015% and T2 only traces. See:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydrogen
 

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