Is Mathematical Induction Proven Correctly for $S_{k+1}:2^{k+1}>(k+1)^2$?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers on the validity of using mathematical induction to prove the inequality \( S_{k+1}: 2^{k+1} > (k+1)^2 \), with a focus on the base case and the inductive step. Participants explore the conditions under which the inequality holds, particularly for natural numbers.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant asserts \( S_k > k^2 \) and attempts to derive \( S_{k+1}: 2^{k+1} > (k+1)^2 \) through manipulation of the inequality.
  • Another participant challenges the initial statements, questioning the validity of starting with \( S_k > k^2 \) and suggesting that the inequality \( 2^n > n^2 \) holds for \( n \geq 5 \).
  • A request for a complete proof is made, indicating a desire for clarity in the inductive process.
  • A detailed explanation of the induction process is provided, outlining the base case and the inductive step, while noting that the inequality \( k^2 \geq 2k + 1 \) needs to be established for \( k \geq 5 \).
  • Participants express varying levels of understanding and clarity regarding the proof steps, with some indicating they grasp the concept but struggle with the presentation of the proof.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach consensus on the initial statements or the proof structure. There are competing views on the validity of the starting assumptions and the conditions under which the inequality holds.

Contextual Notes

There are unresolved issues regarding the assumptions needed for the inductive step, particularly the condition \( k^2 \geq 2k + 1 \) and the specific range of \( n \) for which the inequality \( 2^n > n^2 \) is valid.

Who May Find This Useful

Individuals interested in mathematical induction, particularly in the context of inequalities and proofs involving natural numbers, may find this discussion beneficial.

ineedhelpnow
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$S_k>k^2$

$S_{k+1}:2^{k+1}>(k+1)^2$

$2*2^{k+1}>2(k+1)^2$

$2^{k+2}>2(k+1)^2$

Assume $x=k+1$

$\frac{2^{x+1}}{2}>x^2$

$2^{x+1}*2^{-1}>x^2$

$2^x>x^2$

right?

$2^{k+1}>(k+1)^2$
 
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Hello, ineedhelpnow!

Your statements make no sense.

$S_k>k^2$ . What is this?

$S_{k+1}:2^{k+1}>(k+1)^2$
This is what you're supposed to prove.
You can't start with that statement.
I would guess that the problem is: .$2^n\,>\,n^2$
But note that this is true for ${\color{blue}n \ge 5}.$
 
Do you mind explaining how to prove it. Like going through the WHOLE thing. This is the only problem that I can't get past.
 
It's hard to explain *how* to prove these things without actually proving them, but I'll give it a go.

A. Suppose "something" (a therorem, or a statement of some kind) was true for the number 1.

B. Suppose further, that IF it was true for one natural number ($k$), then it is ALSO true for the NEXT natural number ($k+1)$.

Then, together with it being true for 1, we get a "chain reaction":

Letting $k = 1$, then the second statement (B), means it is true for $1 + 1 = 2$.

Letting $k = 2$, then we find it is true for $2 + 1 = 3$, as well.

Thus, using (A) and (B) together, we can prove it is true for any finite natural number $n$, in $n$ steps. Since it is thus true for ANY natural number, it is thus true for ALL natural numbers.

Sometimes, we have to modify this, and start "higher up the chain", with some number like $5$, or $2$, or $317$, and so we can only prove it for "bigger natural numbers than some starting one".

So let's look at the statement:

$2^n > n^2$.

When $n = 1$, we get:

$2 > 1$, which is true. However, when $n = 2$, we get:

$4 > 4$, which is FALSE.

When $n = 3$, we get:

$8 > 9$, again, this is false.

When $n = 4$, we get: $16 > 16$, which is again false.

When $n = 5$, we get: $32 > 25$, which is true.

When $n = 6$, we get: $64 > 36$, and it appears that the left-side is now growing much faster than the right.

So, provisionally, we shall try to prove:

For all natural numbers $n \geq 5$, we have $2^n > n^2$.

So our "base case" in this scenario, is $n = 5$.

Now suppose it was true that:

$k \geq 5$ AND $2^k > k^2$.

If we can prove this alone establishes: $2^{k+1} > (k+1)^2$, we're done.

Here's what we can use:

$2^k > k^2$ (we might need to use other facts that derive from $k \geq 5$, as well).

Now, it is OBVIOUS that:

$2^{k+1} = 2\cdot 2^k$.

Hence, from our assumption on $k$, we know that:

$2^{k+1} = 2\cdot 2^k > 2 \cdot k^2 = k^2 + k^2$.

If we knew that $k^2 \geq 2k + 1$, we can use the transitive property of $>$ to conclude:

$2^{k+1} > (k+1)^2$, like so:

$2^{k+1} > k^2 + k^2 \geq k^2 + 2k + 1 = (k+1)^2$.

So now the "sticking point" is: for which $k$ is it true that $k^2 \geq 2k + 1$?

(if it turns out that this is true for any $k \geq 5$, we're home-free).

This will set up the infinite proof-chain:

True for 5 $\implies$ true for 6 $\implies$ true for 7 $\implies$ true for 8 $\implies \dots$
 
what i meant is if someone could prove it. :)
 
Last edited:
i understand the idea. i just have trouble showing the steps on paper. in a way that makes sense.
 
Last edited:
Did what I write "make sense' to you?
 
yes (Dull)
 

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