Is There Proof That God Exists?

[Nath]

God is an oudated instituition for the uneducated and meek. The concepts main task is to instill order through fear in a population, this benefits the state, hence the historical yet publicly challenged co-existence of church and state.

The concept is possibly THE ultimate evil - what better disguise for Lucifer?

I would give my eye teeth to view the finances of the Vatican. The only legal organisation on Earth not subjected to legal / public financial audits.

 

[onycho]

Originally posted by FZ+

What the hell are you talking about?
(a) I did not copy that paragraph.

Actually you did not copy your paragraph, you plagarized it. Let's take a look at that paragraph of yours again.

The critical error made is to once again implant the creationist idea of set goals to work to. It doesn't happen like that. The production of many "irreducibly complex" organs have been demonstrated by either peripherals shifting to different functions, or by the development of redundant systems that disappear, in the same way as scaffolding is removed. In the analogy of the watch, in constructing the watch, additional features like clamps exist, and then are removed. Many of these redundant features that are disappearing can still be seen. (eg. the appendix) Behe is a laughing stock of the biological community.http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/behe.html

If you wrote this paragraph on your own, why would you include a reference to some appendix not present in your post?

You are therefore obviously a blatant thief of other peoples ideas and written words therey invalidating anything you state about Behe has the same credibility as your own ability to lie.

Ad hominem attacks are apparently your tool and trade when talking about an institution that is recognized for its integrity and truthfullness. Unlike others like yourself.

The remainder of your post is thereby irrelevant.

 

[Zero]

Originally posted by onycho
Originally posted by FZ+

What the hell are you talking about?
(a) I did not copy that paragraph.

Actually you did not copy your paragraph, you plagarized it. Let's take a look at that paragraph of yours again.



If you wrote this paragraph on your own, why would you include a reference to some appendix not present in your post?

You are therefore obviously a blatant thief of other peoples ideas and written words therey invalidating anything you state about Behe has the same credibility as your own ability to lie.

Ad hominem attacks are apparently your tool and trade when talking about an institution that is recognized for its integrity and truthfullness. Unlike others like yourself.

The remainder of your post is thereby irrelevant.

You are frasping at straws, because you know the facts don't support your position.



And, of course, there you go claiming that the Discovery Institute is well-respected, which is an appeal to authority, and also simply not true. The Discovery Institute is a joke, a front, and a religious and poliical organization. Show me a non-creationist and non-rightwing group that "respects" the Discovery Institute. They are a FRONT, and they are LYING TO YOU. Don't you get it, or is your faith so weak that you need lies to prop it up?


The Discovery Institute is, for instance, well respected at Christianity.com ...as a ministry, not as a scientific organization.

 

[TENYEARS]

Originally posted by onycho
Originally posted by TENYEARS


What you experienced is known as a sudden healing experience. You saw static electricity jump from the metal cross to the neighbor with MS and he was suddenly healed. You see future events and now think you understand all things.

********************************************************************
*** The electricity went from the priest through the individual who was holding a cross in the palm of his closed hand. The cross was "blackend" not a spot of black but blankend to the point where you would only see if you had a bad electrical connection which was arcing over a long period of time or a sudden relase of high voltage.

Wake up.

********************************************************************


Actually this type of event is not new. I have seen cancer patients close to death suddenly have a remission from their disease. I have seen people crippled or with severe strokes, people with severe heart damage and disease all heal and planes that crash into a ball of flame, have more than half the passengers survive. Mysteries or unexplained. Even Jesus Christ is said to have healed the sick, made the blind see and make the dead rise. But these events are also reported to have occurred long before Christ's appearance on this Earth and since his crucifixion.



********************************************************************

"Yes Elisa". Fact is they were all returned to health, what is needed to see would be the accelerated reproduction of a body part or mend beyond the bodies normal means to heal in any statisticlly derived possibility. This would have to be witnessed and made public. This would infer that the conciousness was capable of redirecting energy to accelerate healing. In this case I would unequivically be the only choice, with any reasonable allowance for statistical probablity.

********************************************************************



Do you remember the Star Trek series with Captain Kirk? There was a fictional episode when a young strong ship captain was on a planet where he suffered a severe accident resulting in his being deformed, blind, wheelchair bound and in severe pain all the time. The fictional aliens on this planet had the ability to place a new reality into the mind (consciousness) of that man where he returned to his former healthy self with all the strength and feelings he had prior to the accident. But all was as he assumed existed in his mind's eye.


********************************************************************

No. The only way to the father is though the son. Zero this one is for you. It sounds like a christian spouting the superiority of christ right. Wrong. This statements intent is to say, the only way to god is through gods creation(Son). In essence the materialist transformation of what you are made of. This transformation is purely physical energy process. What it leads to is logical, but I cannot take you there, you must go through yourself to find yourself.

********************************************************************


What if 'we' all exist as consciousness in a picture or hologram that our mind's eye perceives as reality and life on this planet? That would explain many things. What is the limit of our universe, how do such complex events occur that are totally impossible to happen by pure chance events over millions of years. That would explain the nature of matter, gravity, energy and what and where you were before you were born and where you will be after you leave this veil of tears. That unseen hand that formed this holographic image for our consciousness in a timeless dimension would be the driving force, something like those fictional aliens in Star Trek episode.
http://www.holomall.com/Holographic Universe.htm

Ok, I may or may not rip your belief, but I do rip your realization. You are satisfied with opionion, and belief, aspects of this may be true or it may be pure fanstasy. You you are a physican, I suppose you don't have much time to think of the mysteries of this life. I once had huge chunks of time years ago, I used them.

I have physical explantions for every one of the questions you pose. Real answers figured out by me and sometimes the answers were far more than idea black box stored in my mind. Pure thought. Pure sweat. Real answers. When you are ready, you will do that yourself.

My concern as I will restate in the past is the planet and our lack of responsiblity to it, our childrens future and the "continued cycle of life". If humans understood this, the world would change.

Your post on creation was good, build on it or go deeper.

 

[FZ+]

If you wrote this paragraph on your own, why would you include a reference to some appendix not present in your post?

Oh my... Look at your nearest dictionary. Look up appendix, about the second definition.

2: a vestigial process that extends from the lower end of the cecum and that resembles a small pouch

The appendix in a human example of a vestigial organ. It is a left over of a human digestive system that was not irreducibly complex, that is in the process of being removed to leave a more efficient, and less complicated system. It is an example that in evolution, less is often more, and things do not always build up. Basic anatomy, anyone?

EDIT: I might have considered attaching an appendix, but the goriness... may have been rather messy.

 

[onycho]

Plagarize

Originally posted by FZ+

You are frasping (?Spelling) at straws, because you know the facts don't support your position.

I suppose you are trying to say 'grasping' at straws. Actually you are grabbing for a flotation device when you have grabbed onto an anchor. Just disclaiming the obvious does not relieve you from intellectual dishonesty. When you use other people's works, all you have to do is quote it or give some indication of the work product as being from the person you use as reference.

Definition: Plagiarize

1. To use and pass off (the ideas or writings of another) as one's own.
2. To appropriate for use as one's own passages or ideas from (another).

INTRANSITIVE VERB: To put forth as original to oneself the ideas or words of another.

Stealing other people intellectual property as your own is not permitted on this site.

You are being reported to this site's mentor for action at his discretion.

Any derogatory statements you make about the Discovery Institute remains in the same light as a plagiarizer and thief you are. Dr. Behe's work is beyond reproach and you are an ignormaous.

Have fun...

 

[Zero]

This just gets better and better...


Obviously, Behe's work is the opposite of "above reproach", since generally scientists think he is wrong, and for the reason of practicing bad science.

Keep hiding behind your blind faith in liars, though...I don't understand why you wouldn't be dismayed at the Discovery Institute for intellectual dishonesty, but I guess they are following the Biblical call to lie in the name of religious faith.

 

[onycho]

Originally posted by Zero

You are frasping at straws, because you know the facts don't support your position.

Learn to spell before you accuse others. You are putting yourself in the same light as a plariarizer of other people' works.


You make accusations of others like Dr. Behe with nothing more than invectives and distortions about religious bias.

You are a little man who is also a bigot.

 

[onycho]

Originally posted by Zero

This just gets better and better... Obviously, Behe's work is the opposite of "above reproach", since generally scientists think he is wrong, and for the reason of practicing bad science.Keep hiding behind your blind faith in liars, though...I don't understand why you wouldn't be dismayed at the Discovery Institute for intellectual dishonesty, but I guess they are following the Biblical call to lie in the name of religious faith.

How is it that you think that making libelous claims proves anything when you have no evidence for these accusations.

You are apparently born an microcephalic moron. Get a life...

 

[Zero]

Originally posted by onycho
Originally posted by Zero

You are frasping at straws, because you know the facts don't support your position.

Learn to spell before you accuse others. You are putting yourself in the same light as a plariarizer of other people' works.


You make accusations of others like Dr. Behe with nothing more than invectives and distortions about religious bias.

You are a little man who is also a bigot.

LOL

If a group claims to be non-religious, and then it turns out to be a religious organization, that makes them liars, right?

Are you related to Behe, BTW? Is there a reason that you pretend that he is an unquestionable authority?

 

[Zero]

Ok, onycho, here's your one and only warning: you are attacking members of PF for attacking public figures and organizations. Our attacks on Behe and the Discovery "Institute" are fair play; your attacks on us are not. Stop making personal attacks, remove yourself from conversations that make you too angry to control yourself, or find some other place to post.

 

[onycho]

Originally posted by TENYEARS

Ok, I may or may not rip your belief, but I do rip your realization. You are satisfied with opionion, and belief, aspects of this may be true or it may be pure fanstasy. You you are a physican, I suppose you don't have much time to think of the mysteries of this life. I once had huge chunks of time years ago, I used them.

Rip away... You apparently have large chunks but I do not think you are referring to time.

I have physical explantions for every one of the questions you pose. Real answers figured out by me and sometimes the answers were far more than idea black box stored in my mind. Pure thought. Pure sweat. Real answers. When you are ready, you will do that yourself.

You have PURE imagination but I doubt you have one idea about anything as you seem to be unwilling to share these brilliant, out of this world ideas about everything?

My concern as I will restate in the past is the planet and our lack of responsiblity to it, our childrens future and the "continued cycle of life". If humans understood this, the world would change.

Are you a 'tree-hugger'? The amazing thing is that this world has a built in continuous ecosystem to cleans itself no matter what humans or volcanos do the planet. Long before there were homosapiens, the Earth had ice ages, major temperature changes without one car burning fuel or pollution being pumped into the air or sea. You apparently haven't the faintest idea about the magic built into this world for anything man can do to it. The future of mankind will have nothing to do with the world enviornment but more like the ability to destroy themselves with the invention of the subatomic world's mysteries (the atom).

Your post on creation was good, build on it or go deeper.

If I could go deeper, I would be a god.

 

[FZ+]

You are being reported to this site's mentor for action at his discretion.

That would be her. Kerrie is female.

For the meantime, you might consider bringing your righteous fury to the maths forum, where their plagarism is evidence by terms such as indices, and numbers. (obvious reference to page numbers) Also, try that Values thread where they talk about being content. Long live the cause of justice!

 

[onycho]

Originally posted by Zero

Ok, onycho, here's your one and only warning:

Uh Oh, you are so scary...

you are attacking members of PF for attacking public figures and organizations. Our attacks on Behe and the Discovery "Institute" are fair play; your attacks on us are not. Stop making personal attacks, remove yourself from conversations that make you too angry to control yourself, or find some other place to post.

Angry, me? You attack without one shred of proof or evidence with just accusations and envy of those scientists who are so far above your intellectual level.

Anger is always concerned with individuals, ... whereas hatred is directed also against classes: we all hate any thief or any informer. Moreover, anger can be cured by time; but hatred cannot. The one aims at giving pain to its object, the other at doing him harm; the angry man wants his victim to feel; the hater does not mind whether they feel or not.

ATTRIBUTION: Aristotle (384–322 B.C.

 

[Zero]

I don't envy anyone who cannot be honest about their intentions. That pretty much overs the entire Discovery Institute...they are liars, and frauds.

Actually, their crime is worse than that. What makes them so horrible is how the corrupt the intellectual integrity of the people who trust them. I think it is great that people look beyond the attitude of "the Bible says so, so it is true" and try to find out whether their beliefs are backed up by reason and science. Maybe that is why I am so upset that the best they can find is something like the Discovery Institute. They aren't good Christians, because they denounce their Christian ties, but they aren't good scientists, because they start out with the Bible, and manipulate the data to fit that worldview. They are in fact the worst of both worlds, and should be rightly denounced by both sides.

 

[Zero]

Oh, and BTW, I'm not "scary", but I'm a mentor on PF, and I am informing you that you violating PF rules.

 

[onycho]

Originally posted by Nath

God is an oudated instituition for the uneducated and meek. The concepts main task is to instill order through fear in a population, this benefits the state, hence the historical yet publicly challenged co-existence of church and state. The concept is possibly THE ultimate evil - what better disguise for Lucifer? I would give my eye teeth to view the finances of the Vatican. The only legal organisation on Earth not subjected to legal / public financial audits.

Ignorance must be bliss... Your Marxist concepts are very revealing about your fears of the unknown.

 

[Zero]

Originally posted by onycho
Originally posted by Zero

This just gets better and better... Obviously, Behe's work is the opposite of "above reproach", since generally scientists think he is wrong, and for the reason of practicing bad science.Keep hiding behind your blind faith in liars, though...I don't understand why you wouldn't be dismayed at the Discovery Institute for intellectual dishonesty, but I guess they are following the Biblical call to lie in the name of religious faith.

How is it that you think that making libelous claims proves anything when you have no evidence for these accusations.

You are apparently born an microcephalic moron. Get a life...

Just saving this so it can't be edited out later...evidence, it isn't just for scientists!

 

[onycho]

Originally posted by Zero

LOL If a group claims to be non-religious, and then it turns out to be a religious organization, that makes them liars, right? Are you related to Behe, BTW? Is there a reason that you pretend that he is an unquestionable authority?

1) Where do you find any claim that any group claims to be non-religious?

2) No I am not related to Dr. Behe, have never met him and know him only from his books and papers.

3) I have never pretended that Dr. Behe is an unquestional source, it is you who make unsubstantiated statements to the contrary.

 

[onycho]

Originally posted by Zero

Just saving this so it can't be edited out later...evidence, it isn't just for scientists!

WHAT? What kindergarten did you graduate from?

 

[Zero]

Here's Behe:http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/behe.html

And here's the Discovery Institute: http://www.au.org/site/News2?page=NewsArticle&id=5582&abbr=cs_&security=1001&news_iv_ctrl=1075

 

[onycho]

Originally posted by Zero

I don't envy anyone who cannot be honest about their intentions. That pretty much overs the entire Discovery Institute...they are liars, and frauds. Actually, their crime is worse than that. What makes them so horrible is how the corrupt the intellectual integrity of the people who trust them. I think it is great that people look beyond the attitude of "the Bible says so, so it is true" and try to find out whether their beliefs are backed up by reason and science. Maybe that is why I am so upset that the best they can find is something like the Discovery Institute. They aren't good Christians, because they denounce their Christian ties, but they aren't good scientists, because they start out with the Bible, and manipulate the data to fit that worldview. They are in fact the worst of both worlds, and should be rightly denounced by both sides.

Still just your vitriol without proof.

Intolerance is evidence of impotence.

ATTRIBUTION: Aleister Crowley

 

[Zero]

Originally posted by onycho
Originally posted by Zero

Just saving this so it can't be edited out later...evidence, it isn't just for scientists!

WHAT? What kindergarten did you graduate from?

Saving this one too...I can't wait for kerrie to take a look at this thread!

 

[Zero]

Anyhoo, to get back on topic, it seems to me that anything like ID or "irreducable complexity" can't be used as a proof of "God", on account of the fact that it could have been Martians who did it.

 

[onycho]

YEP THATS PROOF ALRIGHT

Originally posted by Zero

Here's Behe:http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/behe.html
And here's the Discovery Institute: http://www.au.org/site/News2?page=NewsArticle&id=5582&abbr=cs_&security=1001&news_iv_ctrl=1075

Zero, do you have a brain in your acephalic head?

You say here's the Discovery Institute as proof of being a religious front group.

Well you forgot to mention one little tiny detail. Your site proofs are the religious group known as the 'Americans United for Separation of Church and State' and that Galapagos Island virtual on-line university.

Hardly independent unbiased atheist anti-religious organizations decrying a scientific prestigious institute like the Discorvery Institute.

You'll have to do better. Try proving your point with The Discovery Site information site itself or a recognized unbiased scientific institute that finds 'Discovery Institute' a religious front.

 

[Zero]

Nobody else really cares about the Discovery Institute, since they are a political and religious group, not a scientific organization.

Now, see if you can't get back on topic.

 

[onycho]

Originally posted by Zero

Anyhoo, to get back on topic, it seems to me that anything like ID or "irreducable complexity" can't be used as a proof of "God", on account of the fact that it could have been Martians who did it.

Never did try to prove irredicible complexity as proof of any G-d. It simply proves that putting broken cans and bottles into a mixer does not produce a working computer.

You are the one equating irreducible complexity with a diety.

 

[Zero]

Originally posted by onycho
Originally posted by Zero

Anyhoo, to get back on topic, it seems to me that anything like ID or "irreducable complexity" can't be used as a proof of "God", on account of the fact that it could have been Martians who did it.

Never did try to prove irredicible complexity as proof of any G-d. It simply proves that putting broken cans and bottles into a mixer does not produce a working computer.

You are the one equating irreducible complexity with a diety.

Nice strawman analogy.

Anyhoo, if irreducable complexity has nothing to do with mythological beings, then why is it being discussed in this thread. Your posting about irreducable complexity is off-topic.

 

[onycho]

Originally posted by Zero

Nobody else really cares about the Discovery Institute, since they are a political and religious group, not a scientific organization. Now, see if you can't get back on topic.

Then why did you bring it up in the first place? It just happens to be one of the many scientific insitutes, teaching facilities and universities that Dr. Behe is associated with.

You are the one trying to prove the impossible with devious accusations.

 

[Zero]

So, getting back on topic, does anyone have any evidence for the existence of any mythological being?

 

[onycho]

Originally posted by Zero

Nice strawman analogy. Anyhoo, if irreducable complexity has nothing to do with mythological beings, then why is it being discussed in this thread. Your posting about irreducable complexity is off-topic.

Strawman analogy? Irreducbile complexity just happens to be a very real observation and well documented. You are the one on this thread that is totally uncomplex with your preconceived ideas about gods and mythological beings.

 

[onycho]

Originally posted by Zero

So, getting back on topic, does anyone have any evidence for the existence of any mythological being?

Are you referring to the mythological Monitar or the white flying horse of Hercules?

 

[Zero]

Originally posted by onycho
Originally posted by Zero

So, getting back on topic, does anyone have any evidence for the existence of any mythological being?

Are you referring to the mythological Monitar or the white flying horse of Hercules?

Those, plus Zeus, Odin, Thor, Yahweh, whatever thing Joseph Smith claimed to have talked to, Vishnu, Allah, Jehovah, Satan, Isis, or anyone of the other 5000 or so deities that people have believed in.

(*the heck is a Monitar?!?*)

 

[TENYEARS]

physican, look the smucks are trying to get your goat. They already stole it and are cooking it over a barbaque. The intent of the orignal conversation is gone and so am I on this thread.

When I referred to time as a physican, it was not ment as a derogatory comment, but that your mind was being channeled on other tasks. As to what I know, part of it will be known as fact in your lifetime. The world is not as it was when life regenerated in the past, today is far different. There are new factors which have never been present before. Everyone has the right to talk in absolutes even if they do not understand them, but to live in them when the tide is not just right will test the metal of your speach.

Zero/FZ, get a life.

 

[TENYEARS]

Originally posted by Zero
Those, plus Zeus, Odin, Thor, Yahweh, whatever thing Joseph Smith claimed to have talked to, Vishnu, Allah, Jehovah, Satan, Isis, or anyone of the other 5000 or so deities that people have believed in.

(*the heck is a Monitar?!?*)

"Moroni". It may have happened. And they may have actually migrated to south america, also. Other sources buddist monks who supposedly landed in south america saw indians with blue eyes and carts I think oxen or donkeys. This was apparently not indiginous to the area. I don't know for all that I read may be a lie so that is why if one does not figure it out themselves they are not interested in the truth. That is the only way the truth may come.

 

[Zero]

Originally posted by TENYEARS
"Moroni". It may have happened. And they may have actually migrated to south america, also. Other sources buddist monks who supposedly landed in south america saw indians with blue eyes and carts I think oxen or donkeys. This was apparently not indiginous to the area. I don't know for all that I read may be a lie so that is why if one does not figure it out themselves they are not interested in the truth. That is the only way the truth may come.

You do realize how funny that is, right? "Moroni"?

Anyhoo, to get back on track, where is the proof?

 

[onycho]

Originally posted by TENYEARS

"Moroni". It may have happened. And they may have actually migrated to south america, also. Other sources buddist monks who supposedly landed in south america saw indians with blue eyes and carts I think oxen or donkeys. This was apparently not indiginous to the area. I don't know for all that I read may be a lie so that is why if one does not figure it out themselves they are not interested in the truth. That is the only way the truth may come.

Misspelled: mythological Minotaur

http://www.offrench.net/photos/photo.php?photo=584&exhibition=5

The proof of a deity has been disproved by your essense causing this thread to have a putrid odor.

 

[Zero]

Originally posted by onycho

The proof of a deity has been disproved by your essense causing this thread to have a putrid odor.

Ummm...what the heck are you talking about?

 

[ahrkron]

Form the website of the Society for Neuroscience (http://web.sfn.org/ ):

SfN Statement on Evolution and Intelligent Design

Recognizing that the theory of Evolution is the fundamental scientific theory or cornerstone that helps us to understand and study the origins and diversity of living organisms, the Society for Neuroscience supports teaching evolution in science classrooms, and opposes the assertion that Intelligent Design Theory (ID) is a valid scientific alternative.

The debate in America surrounding the teaching of Evolution in science classrooms began with the Creationist claim that the Darwinian concept of natural selection was incorrect, despite the overwhelming scientific evidence in support of it. Creationism, a theory attempting to explain origins of life through supernatural causes, as opposed to scientific ones, failed. Intelligent Design, a revised Creationist effort to claim scientific legitimacy, purports to present a highly disputed philosophical theory as valid scientific theory. Differing from Creationism, ID is not directly supernaturally based. Intelligent design cites, as one of its core principles, “intelligent causes” as the explanation of the complexity of biological structures. Attempting to become credible in the face of Creationism’s failure, ID is devoid of potential to create sound scientific results and explanations. Therefore, it would, as its proponents intend, subserve the goals of the Creationist effort.

The theory of Evolution serves as the basis for the biological sciences’ understanding of the origins and diversity of all living organisms and is accepted with remarkable consensus in the scientific community. It explains and supports findings in scientific areas ranging from botany to zoology and embryology to neuroscience. Additional support is found within independent scientific sources such as archaeology and molecular biology. Though scientists can differ regarding certain aspects of Evolution, the differences constitute testable hypotheses. Thus, SfN believes that teaching Evolution is an essential component of modern science education. K-12 science education based on anything other than tested and accepted scientific theory is counterproductive to the education of America’s youth.

For these reasons, the Society for Neuroscience categorically opposes the teaching of ID in science classrooms. Further, the Society for Neuroscience emphatically supports the teaching of Evolutionary theory, as it is necessary for a valuable scientific education and for understanding of the diversity and origin of all living organisms.

The Society was formed in 1970. It has more than 34,000 members and is the world's largest organization of scientists devoted to the study of the brain. It publishes the scholarly journal The Journal of Neuroscience, and a variety of other publications.

(http://web.sfn.org/content/AboutSfN1/Guidlines/evolution.html )

 

[Zero]

Originally posted by ahrkron
Form the website of the Society for Neuroscience (http://web.sfn.org/ ):



The Society was formed in 1970. It has more than 34,000 members and is the world's largest organization of scientists devoted to the study of the brain. It publishes the scholarly journal The Journal of Neuroscience, and a variety of other publications.

(http://web.sfn.org/content/AboutSfN1/Guidlines/evolution.html )

They're only saying that because they hate G-d!


LMAO, good post, bub.

 

[Janitor]

Zero,

Do you seriously doubt that Joseph Smith temporarily had possession of golden plates with writings on them that came straight from the mind of God, and that Smith could read them with magic spectacles provided to him by God, and that Smith carelessly forgot where he left the plates and spectacles so that later on he was unable to show them to skeptics? My goodness, what are we going to do with you?

 

[Zero]

Originally posted by Janitor
Do you seriously doubt that Joseph Smith temporarily had possession of golden plates with writings on them that came straight from the mind of God, and that Smith could read them with magic spectacles provided to him by God, and that Smith carelessly forgot where he left the plates and spectacles so that later on he was unable to show them to skeptics? My goodness, what are we going to do with you?

Oh, how DARE I?!? What was I thinking, of course it makes perfect sense!

 

[pallidin]

I agree.

In my opinion, Joseph Smith's "religion" is complete bunk.
Along with JW's, I guess I'm not sure which I find to be more pathetic or foundationally absurd. OK, both.
What continues to amaze me is that new "recruits" happen every day!
Wow! Are some people susceptable to outright manipulation or what!

 

[pallidin]

To onycho:

Greetings.
I have followed this thread with great interest, and posted a comment from which you took notice and responded. Thank you for your comments, and I do mean that.
I have thoroughly enjoyed the embodiment of the discourse throughout this thread, but have also taken notice of a developed tension between yourself and others. In all fairness, I should point-out that the tension created was by no means one-sided, and several parties are indeed involved.
Nonetheless, I find your comments and insights to be of great interest to me and of value to the community for inspection.
In a forum setting, I would suppose that it is much more advantageous to all if one addresses the issues presented by a poster, as opposed to responding to the emotional interludes of the poster(s) themselves.
Of course, this can be inherently difficult, as strong opinions are often accompanied by strong minds, and are we not tempted to defend ourselves and/or our position under those circumstances?
I know I have done it from time-to-time. But it's wrong. Not only is it wrong for any given discussion, it is also wrong for the participants or "silent" viewers of it.
Much can be gained through discourse. Let us continue in a fashionable way worthy of our standings and endeavors.

Pallidin

 

[Kerrie]

locked for obvious reasons.