Lagrangian, particle/magnetic need solution check

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SUMMARY

The discussion revolves around deriving the Lagrangian for a charged particle moving in a uniform magnetic field, specifically \(\boldsymbol{B} = B\boldsymbol{\hat{z}}\). The proposed Lagrangian is \(L = \frac{1}{2}mv^{2} + q\boldsymbol{v.A}\), which is intended to yield the Lorentz force equation \(m\mathbf{a} = q\mathbf{v} \times \mathbf{B}\). Participants emphasize the necessity of providing a clear derivation and justification for the choice of the potential energy term \(U\) in the Lagrangian, as well as verifying that this formulation correctly reproduces the expected force law.

PREREQUISITES
  • Understanding of Lagrangian mechanics
  • Familiarity with the Lorentz force law
  • Knowledge of vector calculus, particularly the curl operator
  • Proficiency in classical electromagnetism concepts
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This discussion is beneficial for physics students, particularly those studying classical mechanics and electromagnetism, as well as educators preparing for exams in these subjects.

AbigailM
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Preparing for classical prelim, just wondering if this solution is correct.

Homework Statement


A particle with mass m and charge q moves in a uniform magnetic field \boldsymbol{B}=B\boldsymbol{\hat{z}}. Write a Lagrangian describing the motion of the particle in the xy plane that gives the correct Lorentz-force equation of motion,
m\mathbf{a}=q\mathbf{v}\times\mathbf{B}

Homework Equations


L=T - U

\frac{d}{dt}\left(\frac{\partial L}{\partial \dot{q}}\right)=\frac{\partial L}{\partial q}

\boldsymbol{B}=\boldsymbol{\nabla \times A}

\boldsymbol{E}=-\boldsymbol{\nabla}\phi +\frac{\partial \boldsymbol{A}}{\partial t}

The Attempt at a Solution


I'm going to start with the complete lorentz force and remove the electric potential from the lagrangian later.

\mathbf{F}=q(\mathbf{E}+\mathbf{v}\times\mathbf{B})

\mathbf{F}=q(\mathbf{E}+\mathbf{v}\times (\boldsymbol{\nabla \times A}))

\mathbf{F}=q(\mathbf{E}+\boldsymbol{\nabla} (\mathbf{v.A})-\boldsymbol{A}(\boldsymbol{\nabla . v}))

\mathbf{F}=q(-\boldsymbol{\nabla}\phi+\frac{\partial\boldsymbol{A}}{\partial t}+\boldsymbol{\nabla}(\boldsymbol{v.A})-\boldsymbol{A}(\boldsymbol{\nabla v}))

U=q(\phi -\boldsymbol{v.A})=q\phi-q\boldsymbol{v.A}

We are only interested in the magnetic field so we'll ignore q\phi.

U=q\boldsymbol{v.A}

L=\frac{1}{2}mv^{2} + q\boldsymbol{v.A} \hspace{2 mm}\mathbf{:Answer}

As always thanks for the help!
 
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AbigailM said:
\mathbf{F}=q(\mathbf{E}+\mathbf{v}\times (\boldsymbol{\nabla \times A}))

\mathbf{F}=q(\mathbf{E}+\boldsymbol{\nabla} (\mathbf{v.A})-\boldsymbol{A}(\boldsymbol{\nabla . v}))

This is correct, but you should explain how you got it (i.e that you used a specific vector product rule and that 2 of the terms were zero and why) on your exam if you want full marks.

\mathbf{F}=q(-\boldsymbol{\nabla}\phi+\frac{\partial\boldsymbol{A}}{\partial t}+\boldsymbol{\nabla}(\boldsymbol{v.A})-\boldsymbol{A}(\boldsymbol{\nabla v}))

U=q(\phi -\boldsymbol{v.A})=q\phi-q\boldsymbol{v.A}

Your choice of generalized potential is not immediately obvious when looking at this. How did you choose U from this when there are 2 other terms present that depend on your generalized coordinates, momenta and time? There is a step missing in between which will make the choice of U much easier to argue.

L=\frac{1}{2}mv^{2} + q\boldsymbol{v.A} \hspace{2 mm}\mathbf{:Answer}

As always thanks for the help!

Did you actually show that this choice of Lagrangian gives the correct force law?

I only see an incomplete motivation for choosing such a Lagrangian, and no calculations to show that it is indeed a correct choice.
 

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