Measuring the energy of particles

Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the relationship between momentum and energy for particles moving at relativistic speeds, particularly in the context of particle beams. Participants explore how to measure energy based on known momentum and the implications of relativistic effects on these measurements.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation, Conceptual clarification, Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions whether knowing the momentum of a particle allows for the measurement of its energy in a relativistic context.
  • Another participant provides a formula relating energy and momentum, emphasizing that the mass used should be the invariant mass of the particle.
  • A further contribution discusses the approximation for very relativistic particles, suggesting that energy can be approximated as equal to momentum when the momentum significantly exceeds the mass.
  • It is noted that if the type of particle is unknown, measuring both energy and momentum could theoretically allow for the calculation of mass, although practical limitations exist due to measurement precision.
  • One participant reiterates the importance of momentum as the directly measurable quantity in particle accelerators, highlighting the role of particle identification in extracting energy from momentum measurements.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express varying perspectives on the practicality and methods of measuring energy from momentum, with no consensus reached on the best approach or the implications of the discussed formulas.

Contextual Notes

Limitations include the dependence on the precise identification of particle types for accurate energy calculations and the challenges associated with measurement precision in experimental setups.

aveline de grandpre
Messages
10
Reaction score
1
If i have the momentum of the particle, could I measure their energy ? I'm talking about particles in a beam, they are moving in a relativistic speed.
 
Physics news on Phys.org
If you know the momentum you also know the energy,
$$E=c \sqrt{m^2 c^2+p^2},$$
where ##m## is the mass (and mass is the invariant mass and nothing else!) of the particle, and ##p=|\vec{p}|## the three-momentum of the particle.
 
And for very relativistic particles, that is p^2 >> m^2 you have:
E = p \Big[ 1 + \mathcal{O}(\frac{m^2}{2p^2}) \Big]
or that the energy is almost equal to the momentum...

So if you have an electron (m=0.5MeV) that has momentum 1GeV, you can say that its energy is 1GeV... the correction to the energy from the mass will only affect the decimals below 10^{-6} GeV=\frac{ MeV^2}{GeV} which you can check by actually putting numbers in the \sqrt{\text{ }} expression given by vanshees:
E=\sqrt{0.0005^2 + 1^2} GeV = 1.00000025 GeV
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: vanhees71
If you don't know the particle type (and therefore the mass), measuring energy and momentum would allow calculating it - but that is rarely practical as the energy measurements are not precise enough. Measuring momentum and velocity does work, and it is the main idea how the LHCb detector identifies particles, for example. The energy can be calculated then.
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: vanhees71
aveline de grandpre said:
If i have the momentum of the particle, could I measure their energy ? I'm talking about particles in a beam, they are moving in a relativistic speed.

In a particle accelerator beam, the momentum is in fact the dynamical variable that you actually measure directly, not energy. This is true when you use, say, a dipole magnet to extract the "energy" and "energy spread" of the particle beam using a magnetic spectrometer. See Pg. 18 of William Barletta's lecture here:

http://uspas.fnal.gov/materials/09UNM/Unit_2_Lecture_4_Beam_Properties.pdf

It is only with the identification of the type of particle (electron, proton, etc... to obtain the rest mass) can you then extract the energy of the particle, using the equations that have been mentioned in this thread, or look on Pg. 17 of the same lecture notes.

Zz.
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: vanhees71

Similar threads

  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 13 ·
Replies
13
Views
2K
  • · Replies 10 ·
Replies
10
Views
2K
  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
2K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
4K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
3K
  • · Replies 11 ·
Replies
11
Views
2K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
2K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
4K