Need advice on extracting carboxylic acids from an NaOH Mixture

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the extraction of an amino carboxylic acid from a sodium hydroxide (NaOH) solution. Participants explore methods for isolating the carboxylic acid after a reaction, considering the solubility of the acid in various solvents and the implications of neutralizing the NaOH with hydrochloric acid (HCl).

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Experimental/applied

Main Points Raised

  • One participant notes that the amino carboxylic acid is practically insoluble in most alcohols and water but is supposedly soluble in a 20% NaOH solution.
  • Another participant questions the outcome of neutralizing the base in a water solution if the acid is insoluble.
  • A concern is raised about the potential formation of a salt from the neutralization of NaOH with an acid, which may complicate separation from the carboxylic acid.
  • It is suggested that complete insolubility is a myth, and separation depends on finding a balance between what is lost and what remains.
  • Participants discuss the importance of pH control during the neutralization process to avoid dissolving the acid back into solution.
  • There is a proposal to extract the acid into a non-polar, immiscible solvent after neutralization, contingent on maintaining appropriate pH levels.
  • One participant expresses uncertainty about whether neutralization will leave solid residual products in the mixture, while another suggests that most chlorides are well soluble and unlikely to produce solids.
  • It is noted that the solubility of the salt formed from NaOH and HCl may allow for separation from the undissolved carboxylic acid.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the solubility of the carboxylic acid in various conditions and the implications of neutralization. There is no consensus on the best method for extraction, and multiple competing approaches are discussed.

Contextual Notes

The discussion highlights uncertainties regarding the solubility of the carboxylic acid in different solvents and the potential formation of salts during the neutralization process. The specific characteristics of the acid, including its pKa values, are noted as critical factors influencing the extraction process.

Zensation
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I have an amino carboxylic acid that is practically insoluble in most alcohols and in water, but supposedly soluble in an 20% NaOH solution.

A basic reaction is run with an organic solvent/reactant, and the amino carboxylic acid dissolved in the NaOH solution. After the reaction the layers are easily separated. With the NaOH layer separate, by what method is the carboxylic acid able to be extracted from the NaOH layer?

I've read one way to do this is to neutralize the base with equal parts Hydrochloric acid but I am unsure if the carboxylic acid will dissolve in HCL, and if possible, I would want to avoid such acids all together.

Any ideas?
 
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What will happen if you neutralize the base in water solution, and if the acid is insoluble?
 
That is a possibility but then I face the problem of the formed salt(from the NaOH being neutralized by an acid) potentially being unseparable from the carboxylic-acid. This of course could be done if the salt can be filted out from the acid with water rinses, but this would assume that the acid is totally insoluble in water, which, I won't know until I try.
 
There is no such thing as "completely insoluble", and separation is always a matter of finding a good compromise between what is left and what is lost.

Too low pH can probably dissolve the acid back (you have mentioned the amine group, it will get protonated).

You can neutralize and try to extract the acid into some non-polar, immiscible solvent. It may require good pH control.
 
Ah, so, if I carefully control the PH, I can add acid until the PH is neutral, and then I could decant off mixture and be left with the remaining carboxylic acid? Will this acid-base neutralization leave any solid residual products in the mistd of my carboxylic?

I realize that NaOH + HCL will produce a NaCl salt, but this salt will likely be dissolved in the mixture and easily separable from the nondissolved carboxylic, correct?
 
Zensation said:
Ah, so, if I carefully control the PH, I can add acid until the PH is neutral, and then I could decant off mixture and be left with the remaining carboxylic acid? Will this acid-base neutralization leave any solid residual products in the mistd of my carboxylic?

Depends on what was present in the solution, but as most chlorides are well soluble I would not expect any other solids. Unless you happen to have other, weakly soluble acid in the solution.

I realize that NaOH + HCL will produce a NaCl salt, but this salt will likely be dissolved in the mixture and easily separable from the nondissolved carboxylic, correct?

That's the idea. It is all in the fine print - a lot depends on the acid itself, and its pKa values.
 

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