Non-linear Differential Equations and Psuedo-randomness

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around the non-linear Navier-Stokes equation and its relationship to pseudo-randomness, particularly in the context of turbulence and chaotic systems. Participants explore the implications of deterministic equations yielding pseudo-random solutions and the connection to ergodicity.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions whether solutions to the Navier-Stokes equation are known to be pseudo-random for high Reynolds numbers, suggesting a broader inquiry into chaotic differential equations with positive Lyapunov exponents.
  • Another participant notes that many solutions with a global attractor in 3D are pseudo-random but mentions the lack of a general theorem to support this claim.
  • A request for examples of pseudo-random solutions is made, indicating interest in specific cases.
  • The Lorenz attractor is cited as an example of a system that exhibits pseudo-random behavior, along with a mention of the complexity surrounding the Navier-Stokes equation and its unsolved status as a Millennium Problem.
  • A further inquiry is made about the connection between ergodicity and pseudo-randomness in other systems, highlighting ongoing curiosity in the topic.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express varying levels of knowledge and certainty regarding the relationship between pseudo-randomness and the Navier-Stokes equation, with some agreeing on the complexity of the topic while others seek more information and examples. No consensus is reached on the existence of general theorems or properties related to pseudo-randomness.

Contextual Notes

The discussion acknowledges the complexity and unresolved nature of the Navier-Stokes equation, particularly regarding the existence of general solutions and the implications for pseudo-randomness. Limitations in current understanding and the need for further exploration are noted.

Who May Find This Useful

Researchers and students interested in non-linear dynamics, chaos theory, turbulence, and the mathematical foundations of fluid dynamics may find this discussion relevant.

linford86
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I was thinking about the non-linear Navier-Stokes equation this morning and was briefly browsing a text on the subject. I'm aware that one popular approach to dealing with turbulence is to take averages and look at correlators (which, in turn, can be related to field theory.) Now, one thing which strikes me as odd about this statistical approach to dealing with turbulence is that the Navier-Stokes equation is fully deterministic; given some set of initial and boundary conditions, the entire time evolution of the system is determined.

So, I have a question about the Navier-Stokes equation: is it known that the solutions are psuedo-random for high Reynold's number? Of course, one can extend this more generally to dynamical systems with positive Lyapunov exponents -- are the solutions to such systems (e.g., chaotic differential equations) known to be psuedo-random? If so, it would appear to be natural to attack them statistically since they would pass tests for randomness.
 
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Many solutions having a global attractor in 3D are pseudo-random. Howver, I haven't heard of a general theorem.
 
Interesting. Do you have any examples? I'd like to know more about this subject.
 
Check the Lorenz attractor ,for instance.
There are a few theorems connecting ergodicity & randomness, but the general case of the Navier-Stokes equation is monstrous. It's not known if a general
solutions exists ( a million dollar problem) , let alone the contingent property of pseudorandomness.
 
Yes, I'm aware of the related Millenium Problem. At any rate, does anyone have any information connecting ergodicity and psuedo-randomness for other systems? That seems intriguing to me.
 

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