Normalization of free scalar field states

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the normalization of free scalar field states in quantum field theory, specifically addressing the Lorentz invariance of the delta function used in the normalization process. Participants explore the implications of different normalization conventions and the mathematical relationships between delta functions in different frames, including the effects of Lorentz boosts.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant notes that adopting the convention \( a^{\dagger}_\textbf{p} |0\rangle = |\textbf{p}\rangle \) leads to a normalization that is not Lorentz invariant, specifically \( \langle \textbf{p} | \textbf{q} \rangle = (2\pi)^3 \delta^{(3)}(\textbf{p} - \textbf{q}) \).
  • Another participant questions the assertion that the integral \( \int d^{3}\textbf{p} \delta^{(3)}(\textbf{p} - \textbf{q}) = 1 \) is Lorentz invariant, suggesting that this needs mathematical investigation.
  • One participant acknowledges a misunderstanding regarding Lorentz invariance and clarifies their thoughts on the normalization process, referencing Peskin and Schroeder's treatment of the topic.
  • There is a discussion about the identity involving delta functions and how it relates to the normalization of states under Lorentz transformations, with participants attempting to derive the necessary relationships mathematically.
  • Participants express uncertainty about the mathematical steps involved in deriving the factor \( \frac{dp'_3}{dp_3} \) and its implications for the delta function's behavior under boosts.
  • One participant reflects on their understanding of the delta function identity and its application in the context of the discussion, seeking clarification on their reasoning.
  • Another participant confirms the correctness of a previous statement regarding the delta function identity and its implications for the conditions under which \( \textbf{p'} = \textbf{q'} \) holds.
  • There is a mention of a resource that one participant found helpful for understanding vector calculus and related concepts.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the Lorentz invariance of the delta function normalization and the mathematical relationships involved. The discussion remains unresolved, with multiple competing interpretations and approaches to the problem.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight limitations in their understanding of certain mathematical identities and the implications of Lorentz transformations on delta functions. There is also acknowledgment of the need for further exploration of the mathematical foundations underlying the discussion.

soviet1100
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Hi,

if we adopt the convention, a^{\dagger}_\textbf{p} |0\rangle = |\textbf{p}\rangle

then we get a normalization that is not Lorentz invariant, i.e. \langle \textbf{p} | \textbf{q} \rangle = (2\pi)^3 \delta^{(3)}(\textbf{p} - \textbf{q}).

How do I explicitly show that this delta function (of 3-vectors) is not lorentz invariant, say for a boost in the p^3 direction ? What is \langle \textbf{p'} | \textbf{q'} \rangle where the primed frame is the boosted frame?

I thought since \int d^{3}\textbf{p} \hspace{2mm} \delta^{(3)}(\textbf{p} - \textbf{q}) = 1 is lorentz invariant (integral over all space, so includes q)

and as \hspace{3mm} d^3 \textbf{p} = \gamma^{-1} d^3 \textbf{p'}, (primed frame is boosted frame)

so \hspace{5mm} \delta^{(3)}(\textbf{p} - \textbf{q}) = \gamma\,\delta^{(3)}(\textbf{p'} - \textbf{q'}).

so that \int \gamma\,\delta^{(3)}(\textbf{p'} - \textbf{q'}) \gamma^{-1} d^3 \textbf{p'} = 1 stays Lorentz invariant.

However, Peskin gets for the same calculation (p.22-23, eqn.2.34) the result

\delta^{(3)}(\textbf{p'} - \textbf{q'}) = \delta^{(3)}(\textbf{p} - \textbf{q}) (\frac{E}{E'}) using a method that I don't really understand well.

Have I made a mistake somewhere?
 
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soviet1100 said:
I thought since \int d^{3}\textbf{p} \hspace{2mm} \delta^{(3)}(\textbf{p} - \textbf{q}) = 1 is lorentz invariant

Why?

soviet1100 said:
so \hspace{5mm} \delta^{(3)}(\textbf{p} - \textbf{q}) = \gamma\,\delta^{(3)}(\textbf{p'} - \textbf{q'}).

so that \int \gamma\,\delta^{(3)}(\textbf{p'} - \textbf{q'}) \gamma^{-1} d^3 \textbf{p'} = 1 stays Lorentz invariant.

You can't just impose this because you want it to be true. The mathematical relationship between ##\delta^{(3)}(\textbf{p} - \textbf{q})## and ##\delta^{(3)}(\textbf{p'} - \textbf{q'})## has to be investigated mathematically. Peskin and Schroeder does this at the top of page 23.

soviet1100 said:
However, Peskin gets for the same calculation (p.22-23, eqn.2.34) the result

\delta^{(3)}(\textbf{p'} - \textbf{q'}) = \delta^{(3)}(\textbf{p} - \textbf{q}) (\frac{E}{E'}) using a method that I don't really understand well.

What don't you understand about the math at the top of page 23.
 
Sorry, I don't know what I was thinking. Lack of sleep. Of course, \int d^{3}\textbf{p} \hspace{2mm} \delta^{(3)}(\textbf{p} - \textbf{q}) does not have to be Lorentz invariant. I deserve a slap for that, please disregard that trail of thought.

Here's what P&S do: They consider a boost in the 3-direction, with the unprimed frame as the boosted frame as:

p'_3 = \gamma\,(p_3 + \beta E), \hspace{4mm} E' = \gamma\,(E + \beta\,p_3 )

and then they use the identity \delta(f(x) - f(x_0)) = \frac{1}{|f'(x_0)|}\,\delta(x - x_0) \hspace{4mm} to get:

\delta^{(3)}(\textbf{p} - \textbf{q}) = \delta^{(3)}(\textbf{p'} - \textbf{q'}) \frac{dp'_3}{dp_3}

The subsequent steps, I follow. It's just the one above that I don't get. Here is my attempt:

First, isn't the delta function identity \delta[g(x)] = \sum_i \frac{\delta(x-x_i)}{|f'(x_i)|}, where the xi are roots of the function g(x)?

To get a relation between the boosted \delta^{(3)}(\textbf{p} - \textbf{q}) and the unboosted \delta^{(3)}(\textbf{p'} - \textbf{q'}), I suspect P&S have used the identity on the former to bring out p'3.

I take g(\textbf{p'}) = \textbf{p} - \textbf{q}, \hspace{4mm} \textbf{p} = (p_1, p_2, p_3) = (p'_1, p'_2, \gamma(p'_3 - \beta E_p')), \hspace{4mm} \textbf{q} = (q_1, q_2, q_3) = (q'_1, q'_2, \gamma(q'_3 - \beta E_q')). We want the values of p' that will give a zero for g(p') as defined above.

Now, \textbf{p} - \textbf{q} = (p'_1 - q'_1, p'_2 - q'_2, \gamma[(p'_3 - q'_3) - \beta (E'_p - E'_q)])

So \textbf{p'} = \textbf{q'} isn't a sufficient condition for a zero of g(p'), is it? One must also have E'p = E'q, isn't it so?

Are there any flaws in my working? I suspect there obviously are, for I don't know how to get the factor \frac{dp'_3}{dp_3} out.
 
soviet1100 said:
First, isn't the delta function identity \delta[g(x)] = \sum_i \frac{\delta(x-x_i)}{|f'(x_i)|}, where the xi are roots of the function g(x)?

Yes. (Typo in the denominator.) What happens if you set ##g\left(x\right) = f\left(x\right) - f\left(x_0 \right)##?

soviet1100 said:
So \textbf{p'} = \textbf{q'} isn't a sufficient condition for a zero of g(p'), is it? One must also have E'p = E'q, isn't it so?

But the fact that ##\left( \Delta E \right)^2 - \left( \Delta p \right)^2## is frame-invariant gives you ... ?
 
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George Jones said:
Yes. (Typo in the denominator.) What happens if you set ##g\left(x\right) = f\left(x\right) - f\left(x_0 \right)##?

Sorry about the typo. \hspace{2mm} \delta[g(x)] = \sum_i \frac{\delta(x-x_i)}{|g'(x_i)|}. I get it now:

Setting g(x) = f(x) - f(x_i) gives the zeros of g(x) as xi and g'(x) = f'(x) so one obtains the form of the identity used by P&S:

\delta[f(x) - f(x_i)] = \sum_i \frac{\delta(x-x_i)}{|f'(x_i)|}.

George Jones said:
But the fact that ##\left( \Delta E \right)^2 - \left( \Delta p \right)^2## is frame-invariant gives you ... ?

Ah, of course. \Delta E^2_p - \Delta |\textbf{p}|^2 = \Delta E^2_q - \Delta |\textbf{q}|^2, and \textbf{p'} = \textbf{q'} implies E'_p = E'_q. So, p' = q' is indeed a sufficient condition for a zero of g(x).

As for the obtaining the factor \frac{dp'_3}{dp_3}, I've managed to come up with it using intuition and some mathematics that I'm unfamiliar with. Perhaps you would care to comment if it is incorrect, or if there is a better way?

Computing the factor |g'(\textbf{p'}=\textbf{q'})| :

Now, \textbf{g}(\textbf{p'}) = \textbf{p} - \textbf{q} = (p'_1 - q'_1, p'_2 - q'_2, p_3).

According to the definition in the 'addendum' of the first answer (by user 'joshphysics') on this page (linked), one has:

\left| \frac{d\textbf{g}}{d\textbf{p'}} \right| = \left| \begin{array}{ccc} \frac{dg_1}{dp'_1} & \frac{dg_1}{dp'_2} & \frac{dg_1}{dp'_3} \\ \frac{dg_2}{dp'_1} & \frac{dg_2}{dp'_2} & \frac{dg_2}{dp'_3} \\ \frac{dg_3}{dp'_1} & \frac{dg_3}{dp'_2} & \frac{dg_3}{dp'_3} \end{array} \right| = \left| \begin{array}{ccc} 1 & 0 & 0 \\ 0 & 1 & 0 \\ 0 & 0 & \frac{dp_3}{dp'_3} \end{array} \right| = \frac{dp_3}{dp'_3}.

(Actually, the link above defines the total derivative of a vector valued function w.r.t a vector as a matrix of various partial derivatives. I just assumed that the bars in the denominator when applied to a square matrix meant the determinant.)

Did I get everything right?

Even if I did, I confess that there are two pieces of math here that I haven't studied before (I'm a 2nd year undergrad). One is the identity involving the delta function (of a function), and the other is the definition of the derivative of a vector valued function w.r.t to another vector. Could you perhaps point me to resources (preferably a book for the latter) that discuss these concepts?

Thanks a ton for the guidance!
 
Sorry, disregard my questions in the last post. I proved the identity myself and found a good book on the latter subject - Hubbard's Vector Calculus, Linear Algebra, & Differential Forms (A Unified Approach).

Thanks again.
 
soviet1100 said:
Computing the factor |g'(\textbf{p'}=\textbf{q'})| :

Now, \textbf{g}(\textbf{p'}) = \textbf{p} - \textbf{q} = (p'_1 - q'_1, p'_2 - q'_2, p_3).

Corrected: \textbf{g}(\textbf{p'}) = \textbf{p} - \textbf{q} = (p'_1 - q'_1, p'_2 - q'_2, p_3 - q_3)
 

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