Nothing Before Time: Was Existence Possible?

[heusdens]

Originally posted by Jagger2003
Considering that cause and effect is considered physical, I would define acausal as any cause that isn't physical. A possible example might be desire and intent.

Aren't those also physical causes? What makes us desire or intend something? Does this idea in our mind exists withiout physcial causes?

If they exist, I would assume that they would affect physical causes and vice versa. Although it could be one way only. Acausal events would be initiating events. Physical cause and effects would be determined through physical forces and chains of events.

You have not understood the problem. Your understanding is that certain events are acausal and cause other physcial events, which are then causal. What makes 'some' events a-causal, and other events causal, if there can be no determination between those two type of events, since any determintation would refute the very idea of a-causality.

Perhaps it is best to go into an example here as well. I will try to sure how cause and acausal can exist simultaneously within a logical format.

The origin of the consciousness is unknown. Many theories are out there including one assuming the consciousness is a separate entity and linked with the brain. If it is a separate entity, the causes of the consciousness would be acausal or non-physical.

The consciousness decides acausally to take a walk. The physical body goes into physical cause and effect and walks. The consciousness had an acausal desire (or cause) to take a walk. The consciousness had an acausal effect in directing the muscles through the brain. The movement of the brain and muscles would produce a series of further physical causes and events.

Note here is an example of acausal events with a consistent logic and with an expected chain of events regardless of whether we comprehend the origin or workings of the consciousness.

This is a possible example of an acausal events. There could be others. Although I would not expect anything to be magical. The inherent logic of the universe suggests all is logical.

Fortunately this is the philosophy forum. We can explore alternative explanations beyond the mainstream theories and assumptions. I think acausal events are worthy of consideration because they eliminate the logic contradictions within the first cause problem.

You are assume here something very basic, namely you assume that consciousness itself is not material. We don't have to go saying that the very existence of consciousness, is not in form of atoms, since these terms do not apply to consciousness.
But assuming that consciousness stands outside of the material world, and can affect it, would contradict the fact that it is material.

The origin of consciousness is not entirely unknown, we know it developed together with material life forms, and its function is to reflect the material world, so that this life form can interact with it in a sensible way, in order to sustain itself.
No thought you can have exists outside of a material form in your brain, it exist as a pattern in your brain, which consists of material neurons connected in networks, and which accepts and sends signals in an electrical/chemical way.

The position of consciousness towards the material brain is in a way comparable with how software is positioned towards the hardware of a computer.