Pair production inside the atom?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the topic of electron-positron pair production within atoms, specifically questioning why such processes do not occur in hydrogen atoms and exploring the conditions under which pair production might be possible. The scope includes theoretical considerations, energy conservation, and the implications of electric fields near atomic nuclei.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions the absence of electron-positron production in hydrogen atoms, suggesting that the electric field near the nucleus, despite being modified, should still be significant.
  • Another participant raises the issue of energy conservation, proposing that a theoretical nucleus with a large number of protons could potentially allow for pair production due to the binding energy of electrons, but notes that such nuclei do not exist.
  • A different participant mentions the Schwinger limit and expresses confusion about why pair production does not seem to occur despite electric fields exceeding this limit.
  • One participant reiterates the importance of energy conservation, questioning what processes could lead to pair production without violating this principle.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the feasibility of pair production in hydrogen atoms and the conditions necessary for it to occur, indicating that multiple competing perspectives remain unresolved.

Contextual Notes

Limitations include assumptions about the nature of electric fields near atomic nuclei, the conditions under which energy conservation might be violated, and the specific characteristics of theoretical heavy nuclei.

andresB
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Why there is no electron-positron production inside the, let say, Hydrogen atom?. I know that the electric field near nucleus get modified by some form factors making it not as big as the Coulomb field, but still i think is still very big.
 
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Where should the energy come from? Which process would not violate energy conservation?

A theoretical nucleus with something like 150+ protons without any electrons might be able to make pair production because the electron ground state would be so deeply bound its binding energy would be sufficient to make a positron, but those nuclei don't exist. You can still get pair production if two lead nuclei pass very close to each other, mimicing such a heavy nucleus. This is studied at the LHC.
 
My confusions is that above the Schwinger limit it is supposed to be pair productions. Due to the form of the coulomb field electric fields above the Schwinger limit can be found, why in this case that limit seems to not matter?.
 
Again, which process would you expect to see that does not violate energy conservation?
If there is no such process, there is nothing that could happen.
 

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