PF Treasure Hunt - Solve the Clues & Crack the Code!

[Moonbear]

I think it was great, but it moved too fast for snails like myself..

Only insomniacs got to play...you know what they say...you snooze, you lose!

Maybe the next time, clues could be provided in stages, that you're not allowed to solve them out of order (this would be a disadvantage to both Chroot and myself since we both seemed to work backward more than forward). Or maybe they could rely on using some of the knowledge posted in threads here (like going to a homework problem and having to solve it, or solve another similar problem using that method).

 

[chroot]

I was considering writing a php script that would show my clues only at specific intervals, say, one clue per 3 hrs. or so. I'm designing one that is quite a bit more technological/scientific/problem-solving oriented. Are you interested in a techie hunt, Moonbear?

- Warren

 

[humanino]

Well, I did not have the chance to participate
Even from the outside, this game looked amazingly good
I guess if I ever did put my foot into that game, I would have been swallowed in a no-sleep-parallel-universe
Congratulations to the winner(s)
Ramanujan himself might have been trapped in a fractionally continuated elliptical erratic path while trying to solve this out...
And of course, congratulations and many thanks to the culprit of this fascinating masterpiece : namely Gokul

 

[Gokul43201]

Thanks for the feedback folks...I'm glad it was enjoyed, by some, at least.

Chroot, I'd love to take part in a techie hunt (though if I think I'm looking at a Vigenere cipher, I'll let someone else write the code for that). OR, if you'd like help or ideas, I'd be glad to offer.

humanino and arildno : where were you guys ? Oh, I guess everyone's not as jobless as me ! <shrug>

Moonbear : This game would have proceded on schedule (without the overnight break after you discovered for3to0won) had it not been for a curve ball, that chroot inadvertently threw me. By my original plans, I had created several (about 12 or 13) decoy posts for for3to0won in a text document, that I would have pasted into various threads. The actual clue, with the Greek text, was of course meant to go into the "LaTeX Math typesetting" thread. By a stroke of sheer misfortune, chroot locked that thread, virtually nimutes before I was going to do this...after that thread had been running for months now. Who'd have thunk ! So at that point, I had to change plans, and hence requested a time-out to figure things out.

 

[Gokul43201]

Another thing that was fun : When chroot and Moonbear were working on the clues, I just happened to be logged in too at the time, and I could tell whether they were on the right track by watching their movements on "Who's Online"

For instance, towards the end, I was spying on chrooot's movements and I saw something like this :

viewing thread The PF Treasure Hunt
searching forums
viewing thread Simplifying Radicals
viewing thread Group vs. Phase velocity
viewing thread The PF Treasure Hunt (and some minutes later)
replying to thread The PF Treasure Hunt

That was fun !

For whatever it's worth, I'll post a complete solutions to the game in a new thread.

 

[NoTime]

That was fun Gokul43201

 

[Gokul43201]

Thanks NoTime...much appreciated.

 

[TenaliRaman]

Gokul its been fun !
(too bad i could give little time to this ... but i guarantee i enjoyed every moment of it)
though i expected this to go a little longer than this ... :(

-- AI
P.S -> chroot , if u are planning anything like this ... u can definitely count me in ... i have my exams coming up and many things have gone haywire lately but still it would be a pleasure to play this game again ...

 

[Moonbear]

I was considering writing a php script that would show my clues only at specific intervals, say, one clue per 3 hrs. or so. I'm designing one that is quite a bit more technological/scientific/problem-solving oriented. Are you interested in a techie hunt, Moonbear?

- Warren

I guess it depends on how techie it is. As I pointed out to Gokul, I'm a biologist, not a mathematician (mean is one word, not two in my vocabulary)...and I'm definitely not a computer programmer. So, if I need to write programs or understand code to solve puzzles, I won't do very well. Then again, if you throw some of those types of clues in with others like Gokuls that required knowledge of how to search PF, then that would be okay, the technical parts I'd just have to leave for the other game players.

Since you're the code wizard behind PF, are there tricks you can employ that us mere mortals couldn't even dream? Such as making an old deleted thread reappear with now embedded clues?

And now that I know Gokul was watching my every move, and that means other treasure hunters could be doing the same, I'll have to remember to turn myself invisible for the next hunt!

I'm very amused that Gokul managed to create his own conspirator. When I asked about conspirators, that certainly wasn't what I meant. I thought he may have had an admin or mentor on his side to go back and edit threads older threads in order to insert clues without risking them getting noticed by someone quoting them.

When I saw Gokul's comment about threads being locked, it was soon after I saw that for3to0won had started posting, and was worried those were the posts getting locked or deleted.

Oh, just want to add one more thought on getting more participation. Perhaps something as simple as starting the game near the end of the week and into a weekend would work better than starting at the beginning of the week. More folks around who can spend some time time playing if it's a weekend and they aren't supposed to be at work or spending their nights doing homework, etc.

 

[Gokul43201]

I'm very amused that Gokul managed to create his own conspirator. When I asked about conspirators, that certainly wasn't what I meant. I thought he may have had an admin or mentor on his side to go back and edit threads older threads in order to insert clues without risking them getting noticed by someone quoting them.

I gave some serious thought to seeking special favor from the uberlords to allow me to "break some rules", but I decided against it. As a result, the manouevering required to get the clue into "stupid quetion" was quite extensive. When I had the idea, that thread had about 1497 posts. If you look again, ou'll see that I suddenly started putting in a lot of effort into getting that thread rolling. Not only did I want to get to 1504, I also wanted to get that thread into the next page before I put in the edit (which gave me a 24 hour window to ask some really stupid quetions and hope The Bob would be there for me) so people wouldn't inadvertently notice it - espicially if they hit QUOTE. A post is most any other thread suffers the danger of being quted, and hence discovered. Of course, the other thread that doesn't have posts quoted is the LaTeX thread.

Oh, just want to add one more thought on getting more participation. Perhaps something as simple as starting the game near the end of the week and into a weekend would work better than starting at the beginning of the week. More folks around who can spend some time time playing if it's a weekend and they aren't supposed to be at work or spending their nights doing homework, etc.

I agree.

I spent most of the weekend completing and checking the game. By the time I was ready, it was late sunday. It was either "now", or "wait a week", and I was just too anxious to see how it would go...

 

[hemmul]

Huh, good job Gokul! You're the MAN!
Unfortunately i didn't have an opportunity to participate, because, due to my timezone the main part of discussions was held when i was sleeping but anyway i can't forget myself scanning the list of new members starting from member.php?u=17950+ down to 17700+ while trying to find profile of /already/ famous for3to0won :D argh this was evil ...
Looking forward for chroot's challenge!

 

[chroot]

I guess it depends on how techie it is. As I pointed out to Gokul, I'm a biologist, not a mathematician (mean is one word, not two in my vocabulary)...and I'm definitely not a computer programmer. So, if I need to write programs or understand code to solve puzzles, I won't do very well. Then again, if you throw some of those types of clues in with others like Gokuls that required knowledge of how to search PF, then that would be okay, the technical parts I'd just have to leave for the other game players.

I wasn't anticipating actual complete C code -- I was thinking more along the lines of simple pseudocode, like this:

SET X = 1
REPEAT TEN TIMES {
ADD 1 TO X
}

Which I think most people can logically understand even if they don't know how to program a computer.

Since you're the code wizard behind PF, are there tricks you can employ that us mere mortals couldn't even dream? Such as making an old deleted thread reappear with now embedded clues?

There are an astonishing array of tricks I could use. I am currently devising my treasure hunt plan, and I have put some serious thought into using these tricks. I can pretty much make anything I want appear anywhere I want. I can embed hidden statements inside other people's posts without even showing an edited message, I can change people's join dates, user ids, post ids, anything I want. It would be really easy to make a treasure hunt with all those tools available to me.

On the other hand, is that fair? Should I really design a treasure hunt that no one else on the site but Greg could design? I think it might be more fair if I only use the member tools. That way, other people (besides Greg) could follow in my footsteps.

And now that I know Gokul was watching my every move, and that means other treasure hunters could be doing the same, I'll have to remember to turn myself invisible for the next hunt!

Except, I can still see you.

- Warren

 

[chroot]

Huh, good job Gokul! You're the MAN!
Unfortunately i didn't have an opportunity to participate, because, due to my timezone the main part of discussions was held when i was sleeping but anyway i can't forget myself scanning the list of new members starting from member.php?u=17950+ down to 17700+ while trying to find profile of /already/ famous for3to0won :D argh this was evil ...
Looking forward for chroot's challenge!

Can you think of a way around the time zone issue?

- Warren

 

[Gokul43201]

Can you think of a way around the time zone issue?

- Warren

Sorta.

If it all happens during the weekend, and doesn't last forever, you could announce the precise start time in advance (and like you said, release new clues every couple of hourse or so). People who are really crazy about this will stay up if they have to.

And as far as a good start time goes, I think, early Saturday morning (would 7:00am PT be crazy ?) would be best. 7:00 am PT = 10:00 am ET = 3 - 6:00 pm in most of Europe/Africa = 8:30 - 11:00 pm in South/East Asia. Only the Aussies and Japanese get a bad deal.

 

[chroot]

I just thought of a much easier way to deal with time zones. Offer perhaps four independent threads, one for each region of 6 time zones. People would just have to use the honor system to avoid peeking at the solutions in the threads for time zones ahead of them.

- Warren

 

[hemmul]

Can you think of a way around the time zone issue?

- Warren

What about creating extra difficult tasks, so only godlike hunters could solve them faster than 24 hours? :)

 

[TenaliRaman]

If honor system is followed then we can even have separate teams system i.e if anyone is still interested in such a system...
we can have separate threads for separate teams and the team members must go to their threads alone and discuss and not peek into other team threads...

-- AI

 

[hemmul]

I just thought of a much easier way to deal with time zones. Offer perhaps four independent threads, one for each region of 6 time zones. People would just have to use the honor system to avoid peeking at the solutions in the threads for time zones ahead of them.

- Warren

good idea, but only for very very honest people... i do promise not to watch others' threads, but what about other members? also it somehow divides the community - ei it's better when all the discussions are open for all hunters

P.S. it seems the time zone makes its job! Good night! ;)

 

[chroot]

Well, dishonesty just makes the game less fun. I'll bet that anyone who's intelligent and educated enough to solve the kinds of problems I am likely to provide is not going to be dishonest.

And really, you have two mutually exclusive choices:

1) Make all discussion open for all hunters.
2) Make the competition fair for people in all time zones.

Which one is a better choice?

- Warren

 

[TenaliRaman]

If u ask me the first is better,
reason 1> that way no one will be even tempted to cheat or anything like it and we can all be clean souls with nice golden rings over our head...
reason 2> dividing into time zone may not attract equal number of members in each ... prolly it lessens the interactions between the members ... (isn't interaction betn different part of the world an objective of a discussion forum?)

me#1 : But we have problems as ppl from different time zones don't get to work out things ...

me#2 : a few ways round it are ...
1 ... make it really hard so that no one gets it quickly (not an interesting soln)
2 ... make a condition that one can post an answer to the clue only after say 24 hours of posting the clue .. this prolly gives everyone a chance to view the clue ...

me#1 : this is slow going and not only that ... it could extend beyond the weekend and mess up schedules

me#2 : we can live with this i suppose rather than getting stuck in a time zone where participation is less and u find out that some other time zone has already solved everything .. and all because it had good participation ..

I rest my case!
-- AI

 

[chroot]

2 ... make a condition that one can post an answer to the clue only after say 24 hours of posting the clue .. this prolly gives everyone a chance to view the clue ...

You make a good point. Perhaps this is the best way. Unfortunately, people naturally want to compete to be the first to answer a question. If we declare that treasure hunts are just for fun and the admin will not declare winners, then perhaps this is a fine policy.

- Warren

 

[NoTime]

And really, you have two mutually exclusive choices:

1) Make all discussion open for all hunters.
2) Make the competition fair for people in all time zones.

Which one is a better choice?

- Warren

Just a thought.
Could you write a script so that only responses from a particular period could be viewed.
With two threads. One with clues read only. The other with replies that can only be viewed later after the timer expires.

True this setup would require godlike powers to create
But, could possibly be made available general use.

Or mabey just one thread where the thead starter gets to post timer panels.

 

[Moonbear]

I wasn't anticipating actual complete C code -- I was thinking more along the lines of simple pseudocode, like this:

SET X = 1
REPEAT TEN TIMES {
ADD 1 TO X
}

Which I think most people can logically understand even if they don't know how to program a computer.

Okay, along those lines, I could handle it. I did learn a little BASIC eons ago. I could help you dumb down the code if that's a concern, but I'm probably the only one on this board with so little competence in programming.

There are an astonishing array of tricks I could use. I am currently devising my treasure hunt plan, and I have put some serious thought into using these tricks. I can pretty much make anything I want appear anywhere I want. I can embed hidden statements inside other people's posts without even showing an edited message, I can change people's join dates, user ids, post ids, anything I want. It would be really easy to make a treasure hunt with all those tools available to me.

On the other hand, is that fair? Should I really design a treasure hunt that no one else on the site but Greg could design? I think it might be more fair if I only use the member tools. That way, other people (besides Greg) could follow in my footsteps.

It depends on how you use it. If you're leaving a trail of clues, and we are supposed to follow the clues to find those phoney threads, it might actually be more fair than relying on current or existing threads, where the inhabitants of particular subject areas might be more familiar with thread content or accidentally stumble upon a clue without following the trail to get to it. It only wouldn't be fair if you made a thread disappear before we found the clue in it. If you make it clear from the start, as part of the ground rules, that any thread in the forum is fair game for containing clues, then it will actually help make it more challenging (I'd have never gotten that clue AS*TO=THIS if I didn't have a limited time window to search within).

Except, I can still see you.

I'm not worried about you! You'll already know where the clues are hidden. I meant to hide from other treasure hunters so they can't follow me and swipe my treasure just as I'm about to collect the last clue...you know, like always happens in the movies.

Time zone issues: well, like I said before, only insomniacs need sign up. But, I think if you have clues that are released at specific times, then the game won't only occur on your time zone when you're awake to supply new clues. I guess I had an unfair advantage in the last round since Gokul and I are in the same time zone.

I'd rather have one thread with the clues. I'd be honest, but it would drive me nuts not being able to peek into the other threads to see how the other teams were doing.

Maybe you could work out a way that it's sort of like a relay race, where one person isn't allowed to solve the entire puzzle, but has to solve only one part at a time and then pass it on to another participant to have it count. In other words, the way I solved the final clue wouldn't be allowed. Even if I found the whole solution, I'd have to just give one part, and hope someone else playing would pick it up from there, and when the next step was solved, then I could jump back in with a third step, but not sooner. This way it's more of a passing game than a ball-hogging game.

But if you just make the clues diabolically difficult, nobody will solve it in less than 24 anyway!

 

[Moonbear]

You make a good point. Perhaps this is the best way. Unfortunately, people naturally want to compete to be the first to answer a question. If we declare that treasure hunts are just for fun and the admin will not declare winners, then perhaps this is a fine policy.

- Warren

Honestly, not declaring winners wouldn't curb my competitive nature. I would try, but I know I can get carried away in the enthusiasm and forget. Besides, to me, this sort of treasure hunt isn't so much about competing against the other players as it is competing against the creator of the game. What can I say, I'm a mystery junkie, and to me, the treasure hunt was just like trying to solve a mystery ahead of the characters in the book. One of the best parties I ever attended was one of those murder mystery parties where everyone arrives as a character and tries to solve the crime! (I know I've warned you all I'm a geek...surely this has sunken in by now).

 

[TenaliRaman]

Maybe you could work out a way that it's sort of like a relay race, where one person isn't allowed to solve the entire puzzle, but has to solve only one part at a time and then pass it on to another participant to have it count. In other words, the way I solved the final clue wouldn't be allowed. Even if I found the whole solution, I'd have to just give one part, and hope someone else playing would pick it up from there, and when the next step was solved, then I could jump back in with a third step, but not sooner. This way it's more of a passing game than a ball-hogging game.

chroot : ok i decoded ur puzzle Gokul, so we are looking for your Journal eh .. over to you Moonbear ...
Moonbear : ok i read through his journal ... found the answer of 1504 and then got this question find out more abt for 3 to 0 won? over to you Tenali
TenaliRaman : ok i searched abt 43201 and found out that its ohio's zip code and then i searched for ohio's famous ppl and i got Granville Woods. Over to you <insert any poor innocent participant here>
<insert the same poor innocent participant> : hmm now what am i supposed to do with Granville woods

(I know I've warned you all I'm a geek...surely this has sunken in by now).

Moonbear Poirot Sir,
Let me introduce myself i am Captain Hastings

-- AI

 

[Math Is Hard]

Moonbear Poirot Sir,

Ahem... That's Moonbear Poirot MADAME!

 

[TenaliRaman]

Ahem... That's Moonbear Poirot MADAME!

AH!
Madamoiselle Moonbear,
Sincere apologies!

and thank you MathIsHard for your comment is all but welcome!

-- AI