Proof of the strong maximum principle

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the proof of the strong maximum principle in the context of functions satisfying Laplace's equation. Participants explore the implications of the maximum value of a function within a domain and its behavior at the boundary, seeking to understand the conditions under which the function must be constant.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants express confusion about the proof, particularly regarding the implications of the mean value property and the relationship between the maximum value and boundary conditions.
  • One participant suggests that since the average value at the boundary equals the value at the center, it could imply that all values on any circle around the center must equal the maximum value.
  • Another participant proposes using the method of separation of variables in polar coordinates to derive the solution to Laplace's equation, questioning whether this approach is necessary.
  • There is a discussion about the implications of the maximum value being achieved at both the boundary and within the domain, leading to the conclusion that if the average equals the maximum, then all values must equal the maximum.
  • Participants consider the consequences of the Poisson kernel and how it relates to the average value of the function on circles around the maximum point.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the proof's details and implications. There are multiple competing views on how to proceed with the proof and the interpretations of the mean value property.

Contextual Notes

Participants acknowledge the need for clarity on the assumptions regarding the maximum value and the boundary conditions, as well as the implications of the mean value property in the context of Laplace's equation.

mathmari
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Hey! :o

I am looking at the proof of the strong maximum principle:
If a function $u$ satisfies the Laplace's equation at the open space $D$ and is continuous at the boundary $\partial{D}$ and achieves its maximum at $\partial{D}$ and at a point of $D$ then the function is a constant.

which is the following:

View attachment 2666

$x_M$ : the point where the function achieves its maximum

$x_M \in D$

$u(x) \leq u(x_M)=M, \forall x \in D$

$u(x)=u(x_M), \forall \text{ choice of circle }$

(Thinking)

I am facing some difficulties understanding this proof.. (Worried)

So, we take a circle with center $x_M$.

Then from the mean value property we have that:
$$u(x_M)=\frac{1}{2 \pi a} \int_{| \overrightarrow{r'}|=a}{u(\overrightarrow{r'})}ds$$

We consider that $x_M \in D$ is the point at which $u$ achieves its maximum, so
$$u(x) \leq u(x_M)=M, \ \ \ \forall x \in D$$

So, we have the following:

$$M=u(x_M)=\frac{1}{2 \pi a} \int_{| \overrightarrow{r'}|=a}{u(\overrightarrow{r'})}ds$$

But since the integral is at the boundary $\partial{D}$, and we have supposed that $M$ is the maximum of all points at $D$, we cannot say that
$$M=u(x_M)=\frac{1}{2 \pi a} \int_{| \overrightarrow{r'}|=a}{u(\overrightarrow{r'})}ds \leq \frac{1}{2 \pi a} \int_{| \overrightarrow{r'}|=a}{M}ds$$
right??

How can I continue then to show that the function is constant?? (Wondering)
 

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Hey! (Mmm)

mathmari said:
But since the integral is at the boundary $\partial{D}$, and we have supposed that $M$ is the maximum of all points at $D$, we cannot say that
$$M=u(x_M)=\frac{1}{2 \pi a} \int_{| \overrightarrow{r'}|=a}{u(\overrightarrow{r'})}ds \leq \frac{1}{2 \pi a} \int_{| \overrightarrow{r'}|=a}{M}ds$$
right??

Sure you can, but it doesn't help you. (Wasntme)
How can I continue then to show that the function is constant?? (Wondering)

Do something with Laplace's equation? (Thinking)
 
I like Serena said:
Sure you can, but it doesn't help you. (Wasntme)

I thought I could it as followed:

$$M=u(x_M)=\frac{1}{2 \pi a} \int_{| \overrightarrow{r'}|=a}{u(\overrightarrow{r'})}ds \leq \frac{1}{2 \pi a} \int_{| \overrightarrow{r'}|=a}{M}ds = \frac{M}{2 \pi a} \int_{| \overrightarrow{r'}|=a}ds =M$$

So the symbol $\leq$ should be $=$, so $u=M$.

Is this wrong?? (Wondering)

I like Serena said:
Do something with Laplace's equation? (Thinking)

What could I do?? (Wondering)
 
mathmari said:
I thought I could it as followed:

$$M=u(x_M)=\frac{1}{2 \pi a} \int_{| \overrightarrow{r'}|=a}{u(\overrightarrow{r'})}ds \leq \frac{1}{2 \pi a} \int_{| \overrightarrow{r'}|=a}{M}ds = \frac{M}{2 \pi a} \int_{| \overrightarrow{r'}|=a}ds =M$$

So the symbol $\leq$ should be $=$, so $u=M$.

Is this wrong?? (Wondering)

It is correct, but you are restating something you already know.
The left hand side is equivalent to the right hand side. (Wasntme)
What could I do?? (Wondering)

Well... you could for instance write down Laplace's equation in polar coordinates, separate the variables, add the boundary condition that the function of angle has period $2\pi$... (Wondering)
 
I like Serena said:
Well... you could for instance write down Laplace's equation in polar coordinates, separate the variables, add the boundary condition that the function of angle has period $2\pi$... (Wondering)

$$u_{rr}+\frac{1}{r}u_r+\frac{1}{r^2}u_{\theta \theta}=0 ,\ \ \ 0 \leq \theta \leq 2 \pi, \ \ \ 0 \leq r \leq a$$

Applying the method of separation of variables, the solution is of the form $u(r, \theta)=R(r) \Theta(\theta)$

the boundary condition that the function of angle has period $2\pi$:
$u(a,\theta)=h(\theta), h(\theta)=h(2 \pi + \theta)$

The solution is the following:
$$u(r, \theta)=\sum_{n=0}^{\infty} [A_n \cos{(n \theta)}+B_n \sin{(n \theta)}]r^n \Rightarrow \dots \Rightarrow \\ u(r, \theta)=\frac{a^2-r^2}{2 \pi} \int_0^{2 \pi} \frac{h(\phi)}{a^2+r^2-2ar \cos{(\theta-\phi)}}d \phi$$

Do I have to use the last formula?? (Wondering)
 
mathmari said:
$$u_{rr}+\frac{1}{r}u_r+\frac{1}{r^2}u_{\theta \theta}=0 ,\ \ \ 0 \leq \theta \leq 2 \pi, \ \ \ 0 \leq r \leq a$$

Applying the method of separation of variables, the solution is of the form $u(r, \theta)=R(r) \Theta(\theta)$

the boundary condition that the function of angle has period $2\pi$:
$u(a,\theta)=h(\theta), h(\theta)=h(2 \pi + \theta)$

The solution is the following:
$$u(r, \theta)=\sum_{n=0}^{\infty} [A_n \cos{(n \theta)}+B_n \sin{(n \theta)}]r^n \Rightarrow \dots \Rightarrow \\ u(r, \theta)=\frac{a^2-r^2}{2 \pi} \int_0^{2 \pi} \frac{h(\phi)}{a^2+r^2-2ar \cos{(\theta-\phi)}}d \phi$$

Do I have to use the last formula?? (Wondering)

Now that you mentioned it, didn't you have a proof (using that formula) that the average of the boundary is equal to u(0)?
Perhaps you can use that. (Thinking)
 
I like Serena said:
Now that you mentioned it, didn't you have a proof (using that formula) that the average of the boundary is equal to u(0)?
Perhaps you can use that. (Thinking)

Yes, when we have a circle with center at $0$.

At the post #1, I took a circle with center at $x_M$, and then the average of the boundary is equal to
$$u(x_M)=\frac{1}{2 \pi a} \int_{| \overrightarrow{r'}|=a}{u(\overrightarrow{r'})}ds$$
 
Since $u$ achieves its maximum at $\partial{D}$ and at a point of $D$, do we maybe have to suppose that $M$ is the maximum of all points at $D$ and at $\partial{D}$?? (Wondering)

Then it would be as followed:

We take a circle with center $x_M$.

Then from the average of the boundary we have that:
$$u(x_M)=\frac{1}{2 \pi a} \int_{| \overrightarrow{r'}|=a}{u(\overrightarrow{r'})}ds$$

We consider that $x_M \in \overline{D}$ is the point at which $u$ achieves its maximum, so
$$u(x) \leq u(x_M)=M, \ \ \ \forall x \in \overline{D}$$

($\overline{D}=D \cup \partial{D}$)

So, we have the following:

$$M=u(x_M)=\frac{1}{2 \pi a} \int_{| \overrightarrow{r'}|=a}{u(\overrightarrow{r'})}ds \leq \frac{1}{2 \pi a} \int_{| \overrightarrow{r'}|=a}{M}ds$$

Can we continue from here?? (Worried)
Or should I use the average of the boundary in an other way?? (Thinking)
 
Since you can use the proposition that the value at the center is equal to the average at a circular boundary, it follows that all values at any circle around the center must be $M$... (Thinking)
 
  • #10
I like Serena said:
Since you can use the proposition that the value at the center is equal to the average at a circular boundary, it follows that all values at any circle around the center must be $M$... (Thinking)

I got stuck right now... (Worried)
Could you explain me further this implication?? (Thinking)
 
  • #11
mathmari said:
I got stuck right now... (Worried)
Could you explain me further this implication?? (Thinking)

I think it is like this.

Suppose we start with this point $x_M$ and draw a very small circle around it.
Since $x_M$ belongs to the interior of $D$, there must be a radius $r$ such that the circle fall entirely within $D$.

According to the Poisson kernel for the polar Laplace's equation, the value of $u$ at the center is the same as the average value of $u$ on a circle around that center.
Or isn't it? (Thinking)

So the values on our small circle should be sometimes lower than $u(x_M)$ and sometimes higher than $u(x_M)$ in such a way that the differences cancel out on average, giving an average of just $u(x_M)=M$.

However, since $M$ is actually the maximum on $D$, it follows that no value on the circle can be higher than $M$. And since the average has to come out as $M$, no value can be lower than $M$.
Therefore, each value on our small circle must have value $M$.
Or am I wrong? (Thinking)(Thinking)
 
  • #12
I like Serena said:
According to the Poisson kernel for the polar Laplace's equation, the value of $u$ at the center is the same as the average value of $u$ on a circle around that center.
Or isn't it? (Thinking)

Yes, it is like that! (Yes)

I like Serena said:
So the values on our small circle should be sometimes lower than $u(x_M)$ and sometimes higher than $u(x_M)$ in such a way that the differences cancel out on average, giving an average of just $u(x_M)=M$.

However, since $M$ is actually the maximum on $D$, it follows that no value on the circle can be higher than $M$. And since the average has to come out as $M$, no value can be lower than $M$.
Therefore, each value on our small circle must have value $M$.
Or am I wrong? (Thinking)(Thinking)

Ahaa... (Thinking) If there were values that are lower than $M$, would the average be lower than $M$??
 
  • #13
mathmari said:
Ahaa... (Thinking) If there were values that are lower than $M$, would the average be lower than $M$??

Any value lower than $M$ would pull the average down (assuming $u$ is continuous)... (Nod)
 
  • #14
I like Serena said:
Any value lower than $M$ would pull the average down (assuming $u$ is continuous)... (Nod)

Ahaa...Ok! I understand! Thank you very much! (Mmm)
 

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