Understanding the Proton-Electron Orbital: Why It Doesn't Stick to the Proton

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the behavior of an electron in orbit around a proton, specifically addressing why the electron does not collapse into the proton despite the attractive force between them. The conversation touches on concepts from quantum mechanics, energy states, and historical challenges in understanding atomic structure.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions why an electron, when orbiting a proton, does not stick to it despite the attractive force.
  • Another participant mentions kinetic energy and suggests that quantum theory explains why the electron does not radiate energy and lose its orbital position.
  • A participant seeks clarification on the role of centripetal force in preventing the electron from colliding with the proton.
  • It is noted that the historical problem involved the expectation that a charged electron would radiate energy, leading to a loss of centrifugal force, which was addressed by quantum mechanics.
  • One participant states that there are no energy states available for the electron to stick to the proton, highlighting the quantization of energy levels in quantum mechanics.
  • Another participant explains that while the electron is attracted to the proton, quantum mechanics indicates that only specific energy states can be occupied, with the ground state being the lowest energy level.
  • A later reply expresses skepticism about the clarity of quantum mechanics, suggesting that it complicates rather than clarifies the understanding of atomic behavior.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express a mix of agreement and disagreement regarding the implications of quantum mechanics on the electron-proton interaction. While some acknowledge the role of quantized energy states, others question the clarity and completeness of the explanations provided by quantum theory.

Contextual Notes

Participants reference historical challenges in atomic theory and the evolution of understanding through quantum mechanics, indicating that unresolved questions and complexities remain in the discussion.

Imparcticle
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When an electron is orbiting a proton, why is it not compelled to be attracted to the proton? Why doesn't it stick to the proton?
 
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kinetic energy, of course.

why does not release its energy via radiation? Because of quantum theory.
 
You mean the centerepital force is what keeps them from colliding? Can you expand on this?
 
Imp, basically yes. The historical problem was that the electron is a charged body, thus it is supposed to radiate, losing energy and then losing centrufugal force. This was the problem adressed, and solved, with quantum mechanics.
 
There is no energy state available that has it sticking to the proton. This is one of the problems that led to QM, as has been noted. Only specific energy states can be occupied.

The s-state electron's orbital actually has it in the nucleus some fraction of the time, but to actually combine with the proton would require a weak interaction, and that has a really small cross-section.
 
Imp, basically yes. The historical problem was that the electron is a charged body, thus it is supposed to radiate, losing energy and then losing centrufugal force. This was the problem adressed, and solved, with quantum mechanics.
The fact that it loses energy prevents it from being attracted to the proton?

Just how was it resolved?
 
Imparcticle said:
The fact that it loses energy prevents it from being attracted to the proton?

Just how was it resolved?

No, it's still attracted, which is why there is a bound system. QM shows that in bound systems, energy levels are quantized. IOW, not all states are available to the electron - the ground state orbit is as low in energy as it can get.
 
You are up against the brick wall of QM where all problems are solved by inventing more names for things or actions that cannot be otherwise defined. This practice takes you around in circles, each step is mathematically perfect but grammatically confusing; there is no final explanation. That is why physicist are now inventing 'strings', 'branes' and 'super-strings'. Any day now there will be 'super-duper-strings'.
It seems that nothing can stop mathematicians from taking physics into the darkest corners of science fiction. If you want to work in this field (and the number of students willing to do so decreases year on year) you will have to jump on the merry-go-round.
 

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