Proving 0x = 0: A Rigorous Proof and Its Correctness

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around the proof of the theorem stating that 0 multiplied by any number x equals 0. Participants evaluate the rigor of a proposed proof and explore alternative approaches to demonstrating this theorem.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant presents a detailed step-by-step proof claiming to demonstrate that 0x = 0 for all x, using various axioms of arithmetic.
  • Another participant suggests that the proof contains redundant steps and proposes a more concise approach using integers.
  • A different participant agrees with the notion of redundancy but emphasizes the importance of stating axioms in a rigorous proof.
  • Some participants discuss the necessity of explicitly stating axioms, with differing opinions on whether this is a requirement for rigor.
  • One participant mentions that the discussion may not need to continue after clarifying the requirements for a rigorous proof.
  • Another participant acknowledges the need for clarity in communication and the potential pitfalls of hasty responses in discussions.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the necessity of stating axioms in a rigorous proof and the presence of redundancy in the original proof. No consensus is reached regarding the best approach to proving the theorem.

Contextual Notes

The discussion reflects varying interpretations of what constitutes a rigorous proof, particularly in terms of detail and the presentation of axioms. There is also an acknowledgment of the potential for miscommunication in online discussions.

evagelos
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I was asked to write a rigorous proof for the following theorem:

0x = 0 ,for all x.

Is the following rigorous proof correct??

1) 0x = 0x+0...........by using the axiom:for all ,a : a+0=a

2) x+(-x) = 0..........by using the axiom: for all ,a: a+(-a) = 0

3) 0x = 0x +(x+(-x)).........by substituting (2) into (1)

4) 0x+(x+(-x)) = (0x+x)+(-x)......by using the axiom:for all a,b,c:a+(b+c)=(a+b)+c

5) 0x = (0x+x)+(-x).........by substituting (4) into (3)

6) 0x+x = x+0x.........by using the axiom:for all a,b:a+b=b+a

7) 0x = (x+0x)+(-x).........by substituting (6) into (5)

8) 1x = x............by using the axiom:for all,a:1a = a

9) 0x = (1x+0x)+(-x).........by substituting (8) into (7)

10) 1x+0x = (1+0)x.........by using the axiom: for all a,b,c:(a+b)c= ac+bc

11) 0x = (1+0)x+(-x).........by substituting (10) into (9)

12) 1+0 = 1...........by using the axiom:for all,a:a+0=a

13) 0x = 1x+(-x).........by substituting (12) into (11)

14) 1x = x..........by using the axiom:for all,a:1a = a

15) 0x = x+(-x).........by substituting (14) into (13)

16) x+(-x) = 0.........by using the axiom:for all,a:a+(-a) = 0

17) 0x = 0..........by substituting (16) into (15)

Thanx ,any help will be wellcomed
 
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I see redundant steps. How about:

Let n be an integer.
0x = n
0x - x = n - x
(0 - 1)x = n - x
-x = n - x
x - x = n
What can you say about n?
 
EnumaElish said:
I see redundant steps. How about:

Let n be an integer.
0x = n
0x - x = n - x
(0 - 1)x = n - x
-x = n - x
x - x = n
What can you say about n?
Thanks ,a good way to find how much is 0x.

B,t.w, x is a real No
There is an even shorter proof :

0x =0 <===> 0x +x =0+x <===> x(0+1) = x <===> x=x.

But in a rigorous proof we must show the axioms involved .

Where are the redundant steps??

Thanks again
 
You are correct, I should have written "n is real."

As for redundancy, I think you can start with 6; because 0x + x = x + 0x as a postulate. I am not saying you are wrong, but I do not see why you cannot start with 6.
 
Last edited:
"But in a rigorous proof we must show the axioms involved."

No, in a rigorous proof you must make sure details are explicit. Stating the axioms is not a requirement.

Is there a reason for this discussion?
 
statdad said:
No, in a rigorous proof you must make sure details are explicit. Stating the axioms is not a requirement.

yes i agree after that statement there is no reason for further discussion
 
evagelos, I think statdad is referencing to widely accepted standards of proof in general math, statistics, and related fields.

If your instructor/professor has explicitly asked you to state each axiom, then those specific instructions take precedence over general ones.
 
EnumaElish is correct; my response was a little terse, my apologies, but I simply did not want to get involved in another long "gotcha" post involving what is and what is not a "rigorous proof".

Never email in haste - never post on a forum in haste: words I need to live by.
 

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