Quantum Foam: Exploring the Gravitational Effects of Virtual Particles in Space

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers on the gravitational effects of virtual particles theorized to exist in the vacuum of space, exploring their potential role in the context of dark energy and the cosmological constant. Participants examine the implications of virtual particles on gravitational theory and the nature of energy density in the universe.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Technical explanation

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants question whether virtual particles produce a gravitational effect and if they contribute to the missing mass or dark energy picture.
  • One participant suggests that the number density of virtual particles is dictated by the energy in a region, implying that quantum foam may not represent additional mass.
  • Another participant argues that virtual particles must gravitate to maintain the equivalence principle, citing the Lamb shift as an example of their gravitational influence.
  • Concerns are raised about the infinity problem when summing the energy of virtual particles, leading to discussions about the cosmological constant and its relation to dark energy.
  • Some participants clarify that the cosmological constant is associated with negative pressure, which leads to a repulsive effect, contrasting it with gravitational attraction.
  • There is a debate about whether the infinity problem related to virtual particles is analogous to the blackbody radiation issue solved by Planck, with differing opinions on the applicability of similar solutions.
  • One participant emphasizes that the cosmological constant does not act directly on matter and does not push matter closer together, despite its repulsive nature.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the gravitational effects of virtual particles and the nature of the cosmological constant. There is no consensus on whether virtual particles contribute to dark energy or how the infinity problem should be addressed.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight limitations in understanding the implications of virtual particles and the cosmological constant, particularly regarding the treatment of infinity in energy calculations and the nature of gravitational interactions.

Art
Do the virtual particles theorized to exist in the vacuum of space produce a gravitational effect? If so does that mean the virtual particles are a part of the 'missing mass' / dark energy picture?
 
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Wow, that's a really interestig question! Not an expert, but I'd have to say probably not. I think that the amount of activity (number density of VPP's) is dictated by the amount of energy in a given region of space. If that's correct, then the quantum foam would just be another way of expressing the energy density, the mass of which is already accounted for.

Hope somebody a bit more qualified will respond to either confirm or deny this supposition.
 
Yes, virtual particles must gravitate. If they didn't, the equivalence principle would be violated. For example, the rest energy (=mc^2, where m is the "inertial" mass) of hydrogen in the 2p state differs from the 2s state by the Lamb shift, which includes the effects of virtual particles such as an e+ e- pair; if these didn't gravitate, the gravitational masses would not change in the same ratio as the inertial masses.

Now, what about the vacuum? If you naively add up all the energy of all the virtual particles in any finite volume, the answer is infinity. Ooops! So we have to subtract a constant energy density from the hamiltonian to cancel off this infinity. What's left over, if anything, is the "cosmological constant", which is one possibility for the "dark energy".
 
I thought the cosmological constant was a repulsive force, not an attractive one; the opposite of gravity?
 
Avodyne said:
Now, what about the vacuum? If you naively add up all the energy of all the virtual particles in any finite volume, the answer is infinity. Ooops! So we have to subtract a constant energy density from the hamiltonian to cancel off this infinity. What's left over, if anything, is the "cosmological constant", which is one possibility for the "dark energy".
Isn't this similar to the blackbody radiation infinity problem which was solved by Planck by his discovery of the quantization of electromagnetic radiation? Would a similar solution to the infinity problem be applicable in this case?
 
Art said:
Isn't this similar to the blackbody radiation infinity problem which was solved by Planck by his discovery of the quantization of electromagnetic radiation?

No. Though it may sound similar, it's not the same. Planck's law solves the ultraviolet catastrophe for thermal radiation by quantizing the e/m field. The problem these cosmologists have is not with the thermal part, but with the zero-mode part... their fields are already quantized, it's just that they are not happy with "throwing away" the zero-mode part since it sources gravity.

Would a similar solution to the infinity problem be applicable in this case?

unfortunately, no.
 
LURCH said:
I thought the cosmological constant was a repulsive force, not an attractive one; the opposite of gravity?

A positive cosmological constant has positive energy but negative pressure; it's the negative pressure that results in the repulsion.
 
Avodyne said:
A positive cosmological constant has positive energy but negative pressure; it's the negative pressure that results in the repulsion.
What does this repulsive force repulse? If it acts on matter then would it not be akin to gravity in one aspect in that large expanses of space would push clumps of matter it envelops such as matter in a galaxy closer together whilst also acting as a kind of anti-gravity in pushing separate galaxies further apart?
 
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Well, it causes the universe to expand, but doesn't act directly on matter. It doesn't push anything closer together.

There's probably a decent lay explanation out there somewhere, but I'm afraid I don't know where to find it ...
 

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