Quantum interpretations reduced to absurd, in a nutshell

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers on various interpretations of quantum mechanics (QM) and critiques of these interpretations, presented in a concise format. Participants aim to highlight perceived absurdities in these interpretations while adhering to a self-imposed rule of brevity.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants argue that logical positivism renders meaning meaningless.
  • Critiques of quantum logic and consistent histories suggest that QM's consistency relies on denying the rules of logic.
  • One viewpoint states that the statistical ensemble interpretation claims individual outcomes exist but asserts QM is complete without addressing them.
  • Participants propose that QBism and similar interpretations do not deny objective reality but claim no issues arise from its alleged non-existence.
  • Criticism of the many worlds interpretation posits that the universe's complexity is merely a point in an infinite-dimensional Hilbert space.
  • One participant critiques Bohmian mechanics by stating that while particles have exact trajectories, they are unobservable, rendering them irrelevant.
  • Another participant humorously notes that the only non-hidden aspect in Bohmian mechanics is the "hidden variables."
  • A critique of post-classical physics suggests that it merely prefixes "quantum" to existing terms, leading to absurdities.
  • One participant asserts that interpretations of QM are personal theories about one's experiences and observations, referencing John Gribbin's view that they are myths aiding in understanding quantum phenomena.
  • Another participant expands on the personal nature of interpretations, linking them to ambition and the desire to uncover underlying mechanisms.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express a range of critiques and perspectives on quantum interpretations, with no consensus reached on the validity of any particular interpretation or critique.

Contextual Notes

Participants acknowledge the subjective nature of interpretations and their dependence on personal experience, ambition, and the desire for understanding, without resolving the implications of these factors.

Demystifier
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Let us introduce a new rule. You can criticize any QM interpretation you want, but to avoid too much philosophy the argument must be extremely concise. For definiteness, it may contain maximally 2 sentences, 1 equation and 1 reference. The general rule is - less is more.

Here is my take. In the following I criticize various interpretations by reducing them to absurd in just 1 or 2 sentences.

Logical positivism:
The meaning is meaningless.

Quantum logic and consistent histories:
QM is logically consistent, provided that the rules of logic are denied.

Statistical ensemble interpretation:
Individual measurement outcomes exist, but QM has nothing to say about them. Therefore QM is complete.

QBism, relational and other information-type versions of Copenhagenish interpretations:
We do not say that there is no objective reality out there. We say that there are no any problems with this alleged objective reality because it doesn't exist.

Many worlds:
The Universe looks so complex because it is just a point in an infinite-dimensional Hilbert space, where all points look alike. http://de.arxiv.org/abs/1210.8447
 
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Demystifier said:
Here is my take. In the following I criticize various interpretations by reducing them to absurd in just 1 or 2 sentences.
Bohmian mechanics: Particles have exact trajectories but it doesn't matter because you cannot observe them. Observable is only what shut-up-and-calculate allows.
 
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A. Neumaier said:
Bohmian mechanics: Particles have exact trajectories but it doesn't matter because you cannot observe them. Observable is only what shut-up-and-calculate allows.
Bohmian mechanics:
The only non-hidden thing is the "hidden variables". :biggrin:
 
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Demystifier said:
The general rule is - less is more.
Post-classical physics:
Just put "Quantum" before each term. Hence, "quantum mechanics" and "quantum mucus, er, foam".
 
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Strictly speaking, there is nothing to criticize on interpretations of quantum mechanics. At the end, interpretations are more or less personal “theories” about oneself and of oneself’s experience of observations. As remarked by John Gribbin:

“I stress, again, that all such interpretations are myths, crutches to help us imagine what is going on at the quantum level and to make testable predictions. They are not, any of them, uniquely ‘the truth’; rather, they are all ‘real’, even where they disagree with one another.”
 
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Lord Jestocost said:
... Interpretations are more or less personal “theories” about oneself and of oneself’s experience ...

- I would say, of oneself’s ambition in the first place! Typically, the ambition to find a certain underlying mechanism to feel/explain oneself emerging from there.
 
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AlexCaledin said:
- I would say, of oneself’s ambition in the first place! Typically, the ambition to find a certain underlying mechanism to feel/explain oneself emerging from there.

Ambition coupled with ability, preparation and hard work propels that underlying mechanism to emerge. Water appears so different after diving into the pool.

--Norm
 

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