R is disconnected with the subspace topology

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the concept of whether the real numbers, ##\mathbb{R}##, are disconnected when considering the subspace topology. Participants explore definitions, properties of open sets, and the implications of using limits in this context.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants propose that ##\mathbb{R}## can be expressed as a union of two sets, suggesting a disconnection, but question the validity of using limits in this context.
  • Others argue that the sets presented do not cover ##\mathbb{R}## and do not constitute open sets in the subspace topology.
  • There is a discussion about the definition of the subspace topology, with some participants noting that if ##\mathbb{R}## is considered as a subspace of itself, it retains its usual topology, which is connected.
  • One participant suggests that the intersection of the proposed sets is empty, but challenges the openness of the sets involved.
  • Another participant points out that a space with a subspace topology generated by its own open sets returns the original space's topology, implying that ##\mathbb{R}## remains connected.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express disagreement regarding the characterization of ##\mathbb{R}## as disconnected. There are competing views on the validity of the proposed sets and their properties in the context of the subspace topology.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight the need for clarity on the definitions of open sets and the implications of using limits. There is also an unresolved discussion about the nature of the subspace topology when considering ##\mathbb{R}## as a subset of itself versus as a subset of higher-dimensional spaces.

kent davidge
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I want to show that ##\mathbb{R}## is disconnected with the subspace topology. For this I considered that ##\mathbb{R} = \lim_{\delta n \longrightarrow 0 } (-\infty, n] \cup [n+\delta n, \infty)## and of course the intersection of these two open sets is empty.

What I'm not sure is about the usage of limit here. Is this ok? I personally think it's ok, because I'm using limit only for saying that ##\delta n > 0## but that ##n+\delta n## should be the closest possible real number of ##n##...
 
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kent davidge said:
I want to show that ##\mathbb{R}## is disconnected with the subspace topology.
Of what? Where did you find this idea? ##\mathbb{R}## is a straight line, why should it be disconnected?
For this I considered that ##\mathbb{R} = \lim_{\delta n \longrightarrow 0 } (-\infty, n] \cup [n+\delta n, \infty)## and of course the intersection of these two open sets is empty.
And doesn't cover ##\mathbb{R}##, aren't open sets, and should better be something like ##\bigcup_k[n+\frac{1}{k}, \ldots )##
What I'm not sure is about the usage of limit here. Is this ok?
No. It doesn't make sense. You need open sets.
 
fresh_42 said:
Of what? Where did you find this idea?
I mean the subspace topology obtained by the intersection of ##\mathbb{R}## with its own usual euclidean topology. Are'nt sets like those in post #1 open in such topology? And the idea I got by wondering about.
fresh_42 said:
And doesn't cover ##\mathbb{R}##
I thought it did if we consider ##n+ \delta n## as the closest neighboor of ##n##.
 
Or... to give the sets a better look than those in post #1... ##\mathbb{R} = (-\infty,n) \cup [n, \infty)##... intersection is empty...
 
kent davidge said:
I mean the subspace topology obtained by the intersection of ##\mathbb{R}## with its own usual euclidean topology. Are'nt sets like those in post #1 open in such topology? And the idea I got by wondering about.

I thought it did if we consider ##n+ \delta n## as the closest neighboor of ##n##.
I still don't get the point with the subspace. If you consider ##\mathbb{R}## as subspace of itself, why do you use the word subspace then? We can look at it as ##\mathbb{R}\subseteq \mathbb{R}^n\; , \;n\geq 1## and have a subspace topology induced by the one in ##\mathbb{R}^n##. So first we need to define the topology of ##\mathbb{R}^n##. You said the Euclidean topology, so I assume you mean the standard topology induced by the Euclidean metric. In this case, the subspace topology is also just the ordinary topology of ##\mathbb{R}## which comes from the Euclidean metric. Latest here we can forget about the embedding and subspace topologies. Now I would try to prove that ##\mathbb{R}## is connected.
 
kent davidge said:
Or... to give the sets a better look than those in post #1... ##\mathbb{R} = (-\infty,n) \cup [n, \infty)##... intersection is empty...
And ##[n,\infty)## isn't open.
 
Like Pop'n Fresh pointed out a space with a subspace topology generated by its own open sets just returns the original space's topology.
 

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