Radicals again - Formation energy

Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the formation energy associated with radicals, specifically focusing on the hydroperoxy radical's formation from hydrogen radicals and oxygen. Participants explore the energy dynamics of bond dissociation and recombination, questioning whether oxygen bonds need to be broken in this process and the relative energetics involved.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant inquires about the energy associated with the recombination of radicals, specifically asking if it is the same as bond-dissociation energy but with an opposite sign.
  • Another participant suggests that the energy required to form the hydroperoxyl radical can be derived from the energy needed to split it, indicating a potential misunderstanding of the energy dynamics involved.
  • There is a question about whether the O-O bonds remain intact during the formation of the hydroperoxyl radical and the energy implications of breaking these bonds compared to forming the radical.
  • A later reply references specific bond energies, indicating that breaking O2 bonds requires more energy than forming the hydroperoxyl radical, suggesting that higher energy processes favor the formation of the radical.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the energy dynamics of radical formation and the implications of bond energies. There is no consensus on the specifics of the energy relationships or the conditions under which the hydroperoxyl radical forms.

Contextual Notes

Participants reference specific bond energies but do not resolve the uncertainties regarding the conditions under which the hydroperoxyl radical forms or the implications of bond breaking versus formation energies.

rwooduk
Messages
757
Reaction score
59
I know my last question on radicals' interaction with luminol didn't get much attention, perhaps it was too specific.

Please could I ask a last question, I understand that when radicals are formed via bond breaking this is called the bond-dissociation energy, but is there an energy associated with recombination?

For example the energy required for the formation of the hydroperoxy radical from the hydrogen radical and oxygen? Do the oxygen bonds need to be broken in this process? Is it more energetically favourable to break the oxygen bonds than recombine into the hydroperoxy radical?

Where would I find this information?

Thanks again for any help.
 
Chemistry news on Phys.org
rwooduk said:
Please could I ask a last question, I understand that when radicals are formed via bond breaking this is called the bond-dissociation energy, but is there an energy associated with recombination?

Perhaps I am missing something about your question, but the answer looks painfully obvious: exactly the same energy, just with an opposite sign.
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: rwooduk and HAYAO
Borek said:
Perhaps I am missing something about your question, but the answer looks painfully obvious: exactly the same energy, just with an opposite sign.

I hadn't thought about it that way, thanks very much for the different persepective. I will look at the energy required to split the hydroperoxyl radical to give me the formation energy. I've been getting a little lost in radical chemistry and it's really not my area.

Could you comment on my other question about the hydroperoxyl radical, do the O-O bonds remain intact in its formation? From the image...

hpx1.jpg


It certainly appears that way, but the oxygen no longer has double bonds. I am trying to determine if the energy required for breaking the O-O bonds would be less than the energy required to form the hydroperoxyl radical.

Thanks again.
 

Attachments

  • hpx1.jpg
    hpx1.jpg
    5 KB · Views: 630
edit It's ok think I have it now, from this list...

https://chem.libretexts.org/Core/Ph...undamentals_of_Chemical_Bonding/Bond_Energies

H• + O2 = HO2

Therefore to break HO2 we need to break the H-O bond (467 kJ/mol) and form an O-O bond (146 kJ/mol)
To break an O2 bond it takes 495 kJ/mol

Therefore, it requires more energy to form the hydroperoxyl radical than to break the O2 bonds, therefore hydroperoxyl radical formation will be more likely to happen for higher energy processes.
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
3K
Replies
7
Views
4K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
4K
  • · Replies 18 ·
Replies
18
Views
24K
  • · Replies 19 ·
Replies
19
Views
12K
Replies
1
Views
2K
Replies
0
Views
1K
Replies
2
Views
10K
  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
4K