Reducing resonance in a rotating "World"

  • Context: High School 
  • Thread starter Thread starter guyburns
  • Start date Start date
Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the challenges of reducing resonance in a rig designed to film small rotating sculptures, referred to as "Worlds." Participants explore various methods to stabilize the rotation and minimize resonance effects during filming, addressing both technical and practical aspects of the setup.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant describes the setup involving a spring and threads to suspend the "Worlds," noting that some resonate and exhibit erratic motion.
  • Another participant suggests that the movement of the seconds-hand on the clock may be exciting the resonance and proposes using different materials for the suspension to dampen it.
  • A suggestion is made to use a wind-up mechanism on a rigid stick to rotate the "Worlds," which could simplify the filming process by eliminating the need for a hanging system.
  • The original poster acknowledges that while their pole idea did not eliminate resonance, it did slow it down enough to achieve a satisfactory filming duration.
  • There is a shared curiosity about the final audio-visual project, with some participants expressing interest in viewing the completed work.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express various ideas and suggestions for reducing resonance, but there is no consensus on a single effective solution. The discussion remains open-ended with multiple competing views on how best to address the resonance issue.

Contextual Notes

Participants mention the potential impact of the seconds-hand's movement and the materials used for suspension, indicating that these factors may influence resonance behavior. There are also unresolved questions about the effectiveness of different techniques proposed.

Who May Find This Useful

Individuals interested in film production techniques, particularly those involving motion and stabilization, as well as those exploring the physics of resonance in mechanical systems.

guyburns
Messages
44
Reaction score
12
Background
I'm doing an AV about a friend who died 3 years ago. In his spare time he made hundreds of tiny, what he called "Worlds", sculpted out of copper, brass, aluminium, ranging from 1cm to 3cm across, hollow. They don't weigh much. I've set up a rig to film them rotating at 1 RPM. About a dozen of them will be used between chapters in the AV, 10-15 seconds, like a planet filling the screen. See attachment.

Rig Construction (see attachment)
I attached a thread to the centre of the second hand on an analog clock, from which hangs a spring. I chose the spring so I can easily attach new "Worlds" to the hook at the bottom of the spring. The spring does not act as a spring (as far as I can see).
Each "World" has its own thread, super glued to the top, with a loop at the other end which I connect to the spring's hook. The thread is the thinnest I could find – 0.18mm.

Resonance
The problem is – some of the "Worlds" resonate. They speed up and slow down, some even go into reverse. I thought: "Aha – I'll attach a long pole to the bottom of the spring, to act like those long poles used by high-wire artists. That'll add angular momentum, reduce wobbles, resonance, and generally smooth things out".

I made three "poles" out of thin, 1mm solder, 10, 15 and 20 cm across. I also fitted a straw as part of the testing (see attachment), thinking: this won't add much mass, but a lot of air resistance. But still, if I fit all four 'poles' in turn, there are resonances in some of the "Worlds".

Questions
Q1: Is there some catch-all solution to stopping resonance? Or will I have to tailor each 'pole' to each "World"?

Q2: I wait at least 5 minutes to allow resonances to die down, but some seem to persist. If I wait long enough, will resonance dissipate?

Q3: Any suggestions on other techniques to reduce resonance.

World 01.webp
World Rig.webp
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: PeroK
Physics news on Phys.org
Does the seconds-hand move forward in steps or smoothly? If it moves in steps, that may be exciting the resonance. You will need to dampen the resonance and all higher frequencies. That may be done by changing the length of the fibre, maybe substitute thicker and softer string for the top part.

You could hang the world from a human hair, a Kevlar or carbon fibre, which could be much thinner than the thread.
 
guyburns said:
Q3: Any suggestions on other techniques to reduce resonance.
Just take a simple wind-up mechanism (from a toy or bought separately) and use it to rotate the object on a rigid sick. With a static black background the stick will be trivial to remove from the footage.
 
Last edited:
Thanks for the responses. A rigid system, string or stick, would reduce resonance but it would be very difficult to make the "World" hang central, as it does when using a string. I reckon you'd see wobbling.

Anyway, my pole idea, while not eliminating resonances, slowed them down so much that I was able to get the required 20 seconds of relatively smooth rotation by filming for 3 minutes and choosing the smoothest section.
 
I still don't know what an "AV" is, but now I just have to see this video when it's finished.
 
DaveC426913 said:
I still don't know what an "AV" is, but now I just have to see this video when it's finished.
Audio Visual.
 
You can download one of the "Worlds" here. This is a 1080P example in copper. Some I filmed at 2160P (4k).

The AV isn't finished, as these "Worlds" are just chapter markers, but I uploaded this example so my "Depth of Field" advisor could see the result (he was the fellow who spent an evening with me several months ago working out how to film these things). Each 20-second video took about an hour to set up and film, using a Lumix GH4 fitted with an Olympus 1:1 macro lens.
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: berkeman
Baluncore said:
Audio Visual.
So, a "video".
 
guyburns said:
You can download one of the "Worlds" here. This is a 1080P example in copper. Some I filmed at 2160P (4k).

The AV isn't finished, as these "Worlds" are just chapter markers, but I uploaded this example so my "Depth of Field" advisor could see the result (he was the fellow who spent an evening with me several months ago working out how to film these things). Each 20-second video took about an hour to set up and film, using a Lumix GH4 fitted with an Olympus 1:1 macro lens.
Damn that's cool. Mesmerizing.

I love what you're doing to honour your friend and showcase his works. It's brilliant.

Can I offer one note? The image elicits a feeling of claustrophobia because it's crowding the frame edges. Maybe back off the target just a bit. Just enough to give some breathing room top and bottom.

Otherwise, it's gorgeous - really hypnotic to watch.
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 11 ·
Replies
11
Views
2K
  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
2K
Replies
17
Views
3K
  • · Replies 62 ·
3
Replies
62
Views
10K
  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
5K
  • · Replies 7 ·
Replies
7
Views
2K
  • · Replies 36 ·
2
Replies
36
Views
7K
  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
1K
  • · Replies 26 ·
Replies
26
Views
3K
  • · Replies 11 ·
Replies
11
Views
3K