Relativistic particle in a box

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers on the implications of relativistic effects on the Schrödinger equation for a particle in a box, particularly as the velocity of the box approaches the speed of light. Participants explore theoretical modifications and challenges associated with this scenario.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants propose examining the classical Lagrangian in a moving frame to derive a new quantum Hamiltonian for a relativistic particle in a box.
  • It is noted that the volume of the box changes with the reference frame, suggesting that particle density must also be modified in the context of a relativistic equation.
  • One participant asserts that the Schrödinger equation is not Lorentz invariant, indicating a lack of consensus on how to properly address the relativistic case.
  • Another participant mentions that when kinetic energies approach rest energy, a single-particle quantum theory may no longer suffice, advocating for a transition to multi-particle or field theories.
  • A participant reflects on using D'Alembert's solution for the free particle Schrödinger equation and questions the implications of setting velocity equal to the speed of light.
  • There is a suggestion to explore the Dirac equation for a free electron within boundary constraints, with a mention of potential numerical approaches.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express multiple competing views regarding the treatment of the Schrödinger equation in a relativistic context, and the discussion remains unresolved with no consensus on the correct approach.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight limitations related to the non-Lorentz invariance of the Schrödinger equation and the need for modifications when considering relativistic speeds. There are also unresolved mathematical steps regarding the transition from single-particle to multi-particle or field theories.

actionintegral
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Hello,

I was wondering about the Shroedinger equation. I know about the "particle in a box" solution, but I was wondering what happens when the box is moving by at velocity v? And then as v approaches c? What does the equation look like?
 
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actionintegral said:
Hello,

I was wondering about the Shroedinger equation. I know about the "particle in a box" solution, but I was wondering what happens when the box is moving by at velocity v? And then as v approaches c? What does the equation look like?

If it's moving relativistically, you would need a new prescription for studying things.

However, otherwise...

I would suggest that you try writing down the classical Lagrangian for such a system in a moving frame, and then come up with the Hamiltonian for such a system, and operatorize the Hamiltonian to get the new quantum Hamiltonian. It's an interesting exercise to see what happens to QM in a moving reference frame.
 
Ok I will try that.
 
You need to remember that the volume of the box changes with frame. So your particle density (which is [tex]|\psi|^2[/tex] in the SE but will need to be modified for a relativistic equation) should too...
 
Well, the Schrödinger Equation is not Lorentz invariant. While your question seems simple enough, I don't believe there is a consensus on how to correctly do it.
 
From the moment that your particle starts to have kinetic energies comparable to its rest energy, a single-particle quantum theory will not do anymore. You have to switch to, at your choice: a multi-particle theory, or a field theory. Happily, both are equivalent.
 
This morning I did the free particle schroedinger equation using d'alembert's solution (x+vt, x-vt). I guess a particle in a box would be a standing wave solution with nodes at the edge of the box. No problem.

But in a moment of reckless whimsy, I set v=c and the equation still seemed to work. What's up with that?
 
what would prevent one from solving the Dirac equation for a free electron subject to the constraint of the boundaries? (i have not actually tried this myself, maybe it could be done numerically with something like GAMESS?)
 

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