Sequential stern-gerlach experiment

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around a modified version of the Stern-Gerlach experiment, specifically focusing on the sequential application of spin filters (SGz and SGx) on a single particle. Participants explore the implications of this setup for understanding superimposed eigen-states in quantum mechanics.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions whether the outputs of the first SGz filter lead to the same SGx filter or if they create a branching structure, suggesting a tree-like setup.
  • Another participant argues that if there is only one linear sequence of filters, the outputs do not "record" anything, implying that the outcomes cannot be definitively known.
  • It is proposed that if there is a tree of filters, the sequence of measurements will be random, as a known output from an SGz filter will reset the randomness for the subsequent SGx measurement.
  • A deterministic viewpoint is introduced, suggesting that while the sequence may appear random, the outcome can be determined by hidden variables, specifically regarding whether a particle will be included in the measurement sample.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the nature of the measurement outcomes, with some suggesting randomness and others proposing a deterministic interpretation based on hidden variables. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the implications of these interpretations.

Contextual Notes

There are limitations regarding the assumptions made about the measurement process and the definitions of randomness and determinism in quantum mechanics. The discussion does not resolve these complexities.

svnaras
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I'm just getting the basics of quantum mechanics and I had a question regarding a modification of the stern-gerlach experiment that I think might help me understand the superimposed eigen-states better. Could someone please clarify what one would expect in the following situation?

Suppose we take a *single particle* and pass it sequentially through the following set of filters SGz, SGx, SGz, SGx, SGz, SGx, ... so on what will the measured values of the particle's spin be?
Say the result of the first two filters is +, - then will the following filters also record +,-,+,- so on or will the sequence be completely random?

Will the result predicted by QM depend on what sort of interpretation one subscribes to, for example copenhagen vs statistical or deterministic vs non-deterministc?
 
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Do the + and the - outputs of the first SGz filter lead to the same SGx filter, or does each output lead to a different SGx filter, so the system is set up like a tree?

If there is just one linear sequence of filters, then they don't "record" anything - there is no way to tell whether they went + or - if you merge the output stream. Indeed, according to quantum theory it doesn't really make sense to say that there was a definite outcome.

If there is a tree of filters, so by looking at the detector at the very end, you can tell what the result of each spin measurement had to be, then the sequence will be random. A known output of an SGz filter, say +, will cause the next SGx measurement to be random all over again, and so on.
 
If I can propose answer from deterministic viewpoint then the answer is still this:
JustSam said:
If there is a tree of filters, so by looking at the detector at the very end, you can tell what the result of each spin measurement had to be, then the sequence will be random. A known output of an SGz filter, say +, will cause the next SGx measurement to be random all over again, and so on.
And deterministic part in this answer is that after last SG filter only thing you can know from supposed hidden variable is whether particular particle will be included in measurement sample or not.
 
thanks guys ... that seems to clear up some of my doubts
 

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