Similarity between exact equations and potential functions

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the relationship between exact equations in differential equations and potential functions in vector calculus. Participants explore whether the processes of finding potential functions and solving exact equations are interchangeable or if they serve different purposes. The conversation touches on theoretical aspects, mathematical notation, and the implications of these concepts in physics.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Lee notes a similarity between solving exact equations and finding potential functions, questioning if they have the same end goal.
  • Some participants assert that potentials exist only if there is an "exact differential," which must be integrable.
  • Lee expresses uncertainty about whether a potential function is simply the integral of a solution to an exact differential equation, and whether the gradient of this function corresponds to the original differential equation.
  • One participant confirms that the potential is indeed the integral of the exact differential and that taking the gradient yields the integrated function.
  • Another participant expresses frustration with the notation used in physics for mathematical concepts, emphasizing the mathematical definition of exact differentials.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree on the relationship between potential functions and exact differentials, but there remains some uncertainty regarding the interchangeability of the processes involved and the implications of the notation used.

Contextual Notes

There are limitations in the discussion regarding the assumptions made about integrability and the definitions of exact differentials, which may not be fully resolved.

leehufford
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Hello,

I'm currently in a differential equations course, and we are learning how to solve exact equations in the form of Mdx + Ndy = 0.

I immediately recognized this from my vector calculus class as it was used to find a potential function of a vector field (assuming the vector field was conservative). We integrated both M dx and N dy, combined them on a term by term basis and came up with a potential function.

In differential equations we start to do the same thing but then we set the resulting function from integration equal to N (or M, whichever one we didn't integrate).

I was just wondering if both of these processes have the same end goal and/or are interchangeable. If they aren't interchangeable why are they different? Seems like we get a function as an answer to each problem. The problems seem to slightly deviate from each other but I was wondering if this is just my professor's style. Thanks in advance,

Lee
 
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Potentials exist if there is an "exact differential"; that is, the expression must be integrable.

For a concise statement see http://mathworld.wolfram.com/ExactDifferential.html

Here is a treatment of the theory: http://ocw.mit.edu/courses/mathematics/18-02sc-multivariable-calculus-fall-2010/3.-double-integrals-and-line-integrals-in-the-plane/part-b-vector-fields-and-line-integrals/session-63-potential-functions/MIT18_02SC_MNotes_v2.2to3.pdf
 
UltrafastPED said:
Potentials exist if there is an "exact differential"; that is, the expression must be integrable.

For a concise statement see http://mathworld.wolfram.com/ExactDifferential.html

Here is a treatment of the theory: http://ocw.mit.edu/courses/mathematics/18-02sc-multivariable-calculus-fall-2010/3.-double-integrals-and-line-integrals-in-the-plane/part-b-vector-fields-and-line-integrals/session-63-potential-functions/MIT18_02SC_MNotes_v2.2to3.pdf

Thanks for the reply. After reading the MIT document it seems like a potential function is the integral of a solution to an exact differential equation. Is that a correct assessment? Does that make the gradient of the function the original differential equation? Sorry it's still a little hazy.

Lee
 
You have it just about right.

The potential is the integral of the exact differential; when you take the gradient you obtain the integrated function.

In physics the potential is path independent; the gradient provides the negative of the force.
 
I get annoyed at physics notation for mathematics concepts! (A pet peeve of mine.)

In mathematics notation, a differential in two (or three) variables, u(x,y)dx+ v(x,y)dy (or df= u(x,y,z)dx+ v(x,y,z)dy+ w(x,y,z)dz) is an exact differential (if there is a function, f such that \dfrac{\partial f}{\partial x}= u(x,y) and \dfrac{\partial f}{\partial y}= v(x,y)
(and that \dfrac{\partial f}{\partial z}= w(x,y,z)). That is the concept introduced in "multi-variable Calculus", usually in connection with path integrals, and is exactly the idea behind "exact differential equations".
 

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