Is There a True Bijection Between the Natural Numbers and the Integers?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the existence of a bijection between the natural numbers (including 0) and the integers (positive, negative, and 0). Participants explore the implications of a proposed mapping and the conditions under which it may or may not hold true.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant proposes a mapping from natural numbers to integers, suggesting that even natural numbers map to non-negative integers and odd natural numbers map to negative integers.
  • Another participant challenges the proposed mapping, arguing that it fails to be a bijection because it does not uniquely map the natural number 0.
  • A later reply questions the accuracy of the standard textbook presentation of the bijection, implying that it may not account for the inclusion of 0 in the natural numbers.
  • Another participant suggests that excluding 0 from the natural numbers could resolve the mapping issue, providing an alternative mapping for positive natural numbers.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express disagreement regarding the validity of the proposed bijection and the treatment of 0 in the context of natural numbers. There is no consensus on the correct mapping or the implications of including 0.

Contextual Notes

The discussion highlights potential limitations in the definitions of natural numbers and integers, particularly regarding the inclusion or exclusion of 0, which affects the proposed mappings.

Jeroslaw
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There is a bijection between the natural numbers (including 0) and the integers (positive, negative, 0). The bijection from N -> Z is n -> k if n = 2k OR n -> -k if n = 2k + 1.

For example, if n = 4, then k = 2 because 2(2) = 4. If n = 3, then k = -1 because 2(1) + 1 = 3.

My problem arises because if n = 1, then k = 0 and if n = 0, then k = 0. If n = 1, then 2(0) +1 = 1. If n = 0, then 2(0) = 0. If this function is inverted, then the element 0 in Z will map to both 0 and 1. That violates the assumption that the function is a bijection.

Of course, this is wrong. It implies that there are more natural numbers than integers, which cannot be since the natural numbers are a proper subset of the integers. The problem is that the 0 I derived from n = 1 should be negative, whereas the 0 from n = 0 should be positive, but these are equivalent in the case of 0. Anyone know how to resolve this?
 
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Well your mapping simply isn't a bijection. everything in N greater than 0 maps to a unique number in Z, but there's nothing left for 0. it isn't so hard to make room for 0 by modifying the function for either even or odd arguments.
 
So what you're saying is that the standard textbook presentation of the bijection between N and Z is not quite correct, right?
 
Are you sure that the natural numbers in your book includes the 0?? Looks like it would be fine if you excluded the zero. n = 1 maps to 0, n = 2 maps to 1, n = 3 maps to -1..and so on.
 

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