Is √9x a Bijection from N to R?

  • Context: Undergrad 
  • Thread starter Thread starter dirtypurp
  • Start date Start date
  • Tags Tags
    Bijection Function
Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around the function f : N −→ R defined by f(x) = √9x, specifically examining whether this function is a bijection. Participants explore the function's injectivity and surjectivity, as well as the clarity of the notation used in the question.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • One participant asserts that the function is defined for all natural numbers and suggests that its range is [0, +infinity), while questioning its bijectiveness due to the lack of negative outputs.
  • Multiple participants challenge the claim regarding the range, stating it is not [0, +infinity) and specifically noting that 1 is not included in the range.
  • Another participant defines the range as the set of real numbers of the form √(9n) or equivalently 3√n, where n is a natural number, and agrees that the function is not surjective, thus not a bijection.
  • One participant emphasizes the importance of clarity in the notation used for the function, suggesting that the expression √9x could be misinterpreted without parentheses.
  • Another participant defends the clarity of the original question, arguing that while the notation could be improved, the intended meaning is still understandable.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally disagree on the clarity of the notation and the definition of the range of the function. There is no consensus on whether the original question is clear, and multiple interpretations of the notation are discussed.

Contextual Notes

Participants note that the notation used for the function could lead to different interpretations, which may affect the understanding of its properties. The discussion also highlights the importance of precise mathematical language in conveying ideas.

dirtypurp
Messages
8
Reaction score
1
Let f : N −→ R and f(x) = √ 9x

The domain is all natural numbers: {0, 1, 2, 3, ...}

The codomain is all real numbers.

The range i believe is [0, +infinity)

I believe that although the above is a function since every input of x provides a output that fits in our codomain. I also believe that this is a injective function (one to one correspondence) since f(x)=f(y); x=y. However I do not believe that it is a bijection since not every output we get, which is considered to be our range, is equal to the codomain which is all real numbers. For example no negative output can be given.

Does anyone care to agree or disagree?
 
Physics news on Phys.org
The range is not ##[0,\infty)##. For example, ##1## is not in the range.
 
Infrared said:
The range is not ##[0,\infty)##. For example, ##1## is not in the range.
So what is the range? and if so the function isn't bijection then based on what you said
 
The range is the set of real numbers of the form ##\sqrt{9n}## (or equivalently ##3\sqrt{n}##), where ##n## is a natural number. There's not a simpler way of writing it.

As you noted, the function is not a bijection because it is not surjective.
 
Infrared said:
The range is the set of real numbers of the form ##\sqrt{9n}## (or equivalently ##3\sqrt{n}##), where ##n## is a natural number. There's not a simpler way of writing it.

As you noted, the function is not a bijection because it is not surjective.
ah okay that makes sense however the function is injective since every output is only given by one input.

thank you for your help
 
I think it's important to mention that the original question is stated in a totally unclear fashion, because it could be that the square root applies to 9x, but it also could be that the square root applies only to 9 before the result (3) is multiplied by x.

The symbol √9x should never be used without parentheses, as either (√9)x or √(9x).
 
The question in the OP is clear to me (and I think the others who have provided substantive answers), although it would of course be even clearer using LaTeX: ## f(x) = \sqrt{9x} ##. The alternative interpretation is that the question relates to ## f(x) = \sqrt{9}x = 3x ##, which would be nonsensical. And before you say 'but surely it would be better to write f(x) = 3√x', consider that this could easily be confused with ## f(x) = \sqrt[3]{x} ##.
 
Not at all nonsensical! Just probably too simple to ask about. Which is different.

One's text should not depend on others' decisions about what is probably too simple to ask about.
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
2K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 7 ·
Replies
7
Views
2K
  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
5K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
3K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
3K
  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
2K
  • · Replies 14 ·
Replies
14
Views
3K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
2K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
2K