MHB Solve Exercise 1.6 in Greenberg's Euclidean Geometry: Betweenness and Lying On

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The discussion centers on Exercise 1.6 from Greenberg's Euclidean Geometry, focusing on the concept of "betweenness" and its implications for points lying on a line segment. Participants express confusion over whether "betweenness" inherently implies that a point C, between points A and B, must lie on the segment AB. One proposed proof suggests that if C is defined as between A and B, it must lie on line AB due to the definitions and postulates provided. However, there is concern that this interpretation might not align with the definitions, particularly in non-standard geometries where vertical segments could complicate the notion of lying on a line. Ultimately, the conversation highlights the ambiguity in the definitions regarding the relationship between betweenness and lying on a segment.
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Exercise 1.6 in Greenberg's Euclidean and Non-Euclidean Geometries: "Betweenness" and "Lying On"

Undefined terms: point, line, lie on, between, and congruent.

Postulate I. For every point $P$ and for every point $A$ not equal to $P$ there exists a unique line $\ell$ that passes through $P$ and $Q$. $\ell=\overset{\longleftrightarrow}{PQ}$.

Definition I (Segment, Endpoints). Given two points $A$ and $B$. The segment $AB$ is the set whose members are the points $A$ and $B$ and all points that lie on the line $\overset{\longleftrightarrow}{AB}$ and are between $A$ and $B$. The two given points $A$ and $B$ are called the endpoints of the segment $AB$.

Postulate II (Segment Extension). For every segment $AB$ and for every segment $CD$ there exists a unique point $E$ on $\overset{\longleftrightarrow}{AB}$ such that $B$ is between $A$ and $E$ and segment $CD$ is congruent to segment $BE$.

Definition II (Circle, Radius, Center). Given two points $O$ and $A$. The set of all points $P$ such that segment $OP$ is congruent to segment $OA$ is called a circle with $O$ as center, and each of the segments $OP$ is called a radius of the circle.

Postulate III (Existence of Circles). For every point $O$ and every point $A$ not equal to $O$ there exists a circle with center $O$ and radius $OA$.

Definition III (Ray, Emanate, Vertex, Part). The ray $\overset{\longrightarrow}{AB}$ is the following set of points lying on the line $\overset{\longleftrightarrow}{AB}$: those points that belong to the segment $AB$ and all points $C$ on $\overset{\longleftrightarrow}{AB}$ such that $B$ is between $A$ and $C$. The ray $\overset{\longrightarrow}{AB}$ is said to emanate from the vertex $A$ and to be part of line $\overset{\longleftrightarrow}{AB}$.

Definition IV (Opposite Rays). Rays $\overset{\longrightarrow}{AB}$ and $\overset{\longrightarrow}{AC}$ are opposite if they are distinct, if they emanate from the same point $A$, and if they are part of the same line $\overset{\longleftrightarrow}{AB}=\overset{\longleftrightarrow}{AC}$.

Definition V (Angle, Vertex, Sides). An angle with vertex $A$ is a point $A$ together with two distinct nonopposite rays $\overset{\longrightarrow}{AB}$ and $\overset{\longrightarrow}{AC}$ (called the sides of the angle) emanating from $A$. Notations: $\sphericalangle A, \; \sphericalangle BAC, \; \sphericalangle CAB$.

Definition VI (Supplementary Angles). If two angles $\sphericalangle BAD$ and $\sphericalangle CAD$ have a common side $\overset{\longrightarrow}{AD}$ and the other two sides $\overset{\longrightarrow}{AB}$ and $\overset{\longrightarrow}{AC}$ form opposite rays, the angles are supplements of each other, or supplementary angles.

Definition VIII (Right Angle). An angle $\sphericalangle BAD$ is a right angle if it has a supplementary angle to which it is congruent.

Postulate IV (Congruence of Right Angles). All right angles are congruent to each other.

Definition VIII (Parallel Lines). Two lines $\ell$ and $m$ are parallel if they do not intersect; i.e., if no point lies on both of them. We denote this by $\ell \| m$.

Euclidean Parallel Postulate (Playfair's Axiom). For every line $\ell$ and for every point $P$ that does not lie on $\ell$ there exists a unique line $m$ through $P$ that is parallel to $\ell$.

Definition (Perpendicular Lines). Two lines $\ell$ and $m$ are perpendicular if they intersect at a point $A$ and if there is a ray $\overset{\longrightarrow}{AB}$ that is a part of $\ell$ and a ray $\overset{\longrightarrow}{AC}$ that is a part of $m$ such that $\sphericalangle BAC$ is a right angle. We denote this by $\ell \perp m$.

So much for the definitions and postulates. The problem statement is the following (part a): Given two points $A$ and $B$ and a third point $C$ between them. Can you think of any way to prove from the postulates that $C$ lies on line $\overset{\longleftrightarrow}{AB}$?

My issue is that the concept of "betweenness", being undefined, does not seem inherently to include the idea of lying on the segment. That is, suppose $C$ is "between" $A$ and $B$. Nowhere in these definitions and postulates does it seem to be implied that $C$ must lie on segment $AB$. I feel like I'm missing something basic here. Any ideas?

If "betweenness" automatically includes the concept of lying on the segment, then I could prove as follows:

By definition, $C$ is on segment $AB$. By Postulate I, there is a unique line $\ell$ on $A$ and $B$, and $\ell=\overset{\longleftrightarrow}{AB}$. By definition, all points in $AB$ lie on $\ell$, hence $C$ lies on $\ell$. Quod Erat Demonstrandum.

Is this all that's being asked?
 
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I am likewise confused. For example, if we were to imagine the real vector space $\Bbb R^2$ as a model for these axioms, it could conceivably be that $C$ being "between" $A$ and $B$ meant that the $x$-coordinate of $C$ lay between the $x$-coordinate of $A$ and the $x$-coordinate of $B$. Of course this makes "vertical segments" all lines, but that doesn't seem inconsistent with the definitions, as given.

One gets a slightly unusual geometry with this interpretation: vertical rays are also lines, and vertical rays can never be "opposite" since every point on the line is "between" any two points on it. I suspect this can be modified to be a model of the projective plane (or perhaps the projective line-a circle, and a cartesian product with the line; that is, a tube), but the exact details escape me.

This interpretation is not *that* far-fetched, being a normal way we actually determine "betweeness" using the injectiveness of a linear function (vertical lines aren't functions).

Perhaps Definition I is meant to imply that the ONLY points between A and B lie on the line segment AB, but it stops somewhat short of saying that.
 
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