Solving Force Analysis: Understanding Vertical and Horizontal Forces

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around understanding the relationship between vertical and horizontal forces in a static system involving a bracket and a pivot point. Participants explore how to analyze forces and torques in this context, with a focus on resolving forces and calculating torque.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant expresses confusion about how to derive a horizontal force (Fx) from a vertical force (Fy) acting on a bracket.
  • Another participant suggests resolving the total torque about the pivot point, noting that the net torque must be zero for a static object.
  • A participant questions whether torque can be translated into force, particularly in relation to the ratings of fixings in kN.
  • It is noted that there are more unknown forces than equations available, complicating the analysis, especially considering the pivot point's characteristics.
  • A mathematical expression for torque is provided, indicating that the total torque can be expressed in terms of the forces and distances involved.
  • A later reply confirms that torque can indeed be translated into force, providing a formula for calculating force from torque and distance.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the best approach to relate vertical and horizontal forces, and multiple viewpoints regarding the analysis of forces and torques remain present.

Contextual Notes

There are limitations in the discussion, including missing assumptions about the dimensions and configuration of the system, as well as the dependency on specific definitions of forces and torques.

GBE111
Hi, I'm trying to figure out the forces Fx in the drawing I have uploaded. If I have a vertical force Fy acting on the bracket I have drawn. I know from experience that this force is going to pull my bracket horizontally but I can't figure out how I work out a horizontal force from a vertical one? Please help??

20170724_205348.jpg
 
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Since you're dealing with a rigid body with one pivot point you will want to resolve the total torque about the pivot. These will be functions of the dimensional parameters and the applied forces. Since the object is static the net torque is zero.
 
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GBE111 said:
Hi, I'm trying to figure out the forces Fx in the drawing I have uploaded. If I have a vertical force Fy acting on the bracket I have drawn. I know from experience that this force is going to pull my bracket horizontally but I can't figure out how I work out a horizontal force from a vertical one? Please help??

View attachment 207735
 
Can I translate the torque into force? As the fixings I have at Fx are rated in kN?
 
The problem with working with forces is that there are more unknown forces than force equations since the pivot point is applying a force. However the pivot point cannot apply a torque about itself by the nature of it being a pivot point. Now your diagram does not show the total length in the y direction but calling that L, the total torque (which adds to 0) is (taking the CCW direction as positive) (and as I read the diagram):
[tex]0 = F_x \cdot (L-y) - F_y \cdot x[/tex]
and the units assuming distances are in meters is kNm as you indicated the forces are give in kiloNewtons.

A Torque times the perpendicular distance off center by which it acts. In a more general setting one can express it in terms of cross products but units will end up being force times distance.
 
GBE111 said:
Can I translate the torque into force?
Yes.
torque = force x distance, so force = torque/distance
The distance being the distance from the pivot, perpendicular to the line of action of the force.
Examples below. (Lxd is the torque caused by the load.)

bracket.png
 

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