Steady state temperature of insulated rod

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around finding the steady state temperature of a laterally insulated rod with specified boundary conditions. Participants explore the application of the heat conduction equation and the separation of solutions into steady and transient components.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant presents the problem and introduces the equation for the temperature distribution as a sum of steady and transient solutions, but expresses uncertainty about the next steps.
  • Another participant explains the heat conduction equation and derives new equations from the separation of steady and transient solutions, suggesting that the steady-state solution can be expressed as a linear function.
  • A third participant acknowledges the detailed explanation provided and expresses appreciation for the clarity of the response.
  • A later reply questions the interpretation of the steady-state and transient solutions, suggesting a potential misunderstanding in the labeling of the solutions and seeks clarification on the derivation of coefficients in the linear equation.
  • Further clarification is provided regarding the boundary conditions and the derivation of the steady-state solution, confirming the values of coefficients based on the specified conditions.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree on the form of the heat conduction equation and the approach to separating solutions. However, there is some disagreement regarding the interpretation of which solution is steady and which is transient, as well as the derivation of specific coefficients.

Contextual Notes

The discussion includes assumptions about the linearity of the steady-state solution and the boundary conditions applied. There are unresolved questions regarding the integration steps and the specific values of coefficients derived from the boundary conditions.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be useful for individuals interested in heat conduction problems, mathematical modeling of physical systems, and those seeking clarification on the application of boundary conditions in differential equations.

jc2009
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Problem: Find the steady state temperature of a laterally insulated rod subject to the following conditions. Length of the rod 10, , left end kept at 0 and right end at 100

Solution: i got this equation from a book i don't know if this applied to this problem but i don't know what to do.
u(x,t) = v(x) + w(x,t) , v is the steady solution and w the transient putting this is the PDE of Heat , we get two equations , one of which is a function of v and this can be easily solved ( but i don't see what the equations are) .

From this point i don't know what to do

thanks
 
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Hello jc2009,

The basic equation of heat conduction in 1 dimension is given as:
\frac{\partial u}{\partial t}=k \cdot \frac{\partial ^2 u}{\partial x^2}
Now if it can be assumed that the equation can be written as the sum of a transient and steady state part as follows:
u(x,t)=v(x)+w(x,t)
with v(x) the steady-state and w(x,t) the transient solution and u(x,t) the total solution, you can obtain two new equations by substituting this into the original PDE. This is thus:
\frac{\partial v}{\partial t}+\frac{\partial w}{\partial t}=k \cdot \left[\frac{\partial ^2 v}{\partial x^2}+ \frac{\partial ^2 w}{\partial x^2}\right]
Now the first term is zero because the steady-state is independent of time. This gives two new equations as follows:
\frac{\partial w}{\partial t}=k \cdot \frac{\partial ^2 w}{\partial x^2}
0=\frac{\partial ^2 v}{\partial x^2}
The second one gives you the steady-state solution, the first one the transient one. In your case the solution for the transient can be written as:
v(x)=A\cdot x + B
Using the boundary conditions, you get:
v(x)=10\cdot x

Hope this helps,
coomast
 
coomast said:
Hello jc2009,

The basic equation of heat conduction in 1 dimension is given as:
\frac{\partial u}{\partial t}=k \cdot \frac{\partial ^2 u}{\partial x^2}
Now if it can be assumed that the equation can be written as the sum of a transient and steady state part as follows:
u(x,t)=v(x)+w(x,t)
with v(x) the steady-state and w(x,t) the transient solution and u(x,t) the total solution, you can obtain two new equations by substituting this into the original PDE. This is thus:
\frac{\partial v}{\partial t}+\frac{\partial w}{\partial t}=k \cdot \left[\frac{\partial ^2 v}{\partial x^2}+ \frac{\partial ^2 w}{\partial x^2}\right]
Now the first term is zero because the steady-state is independent of time. This gives two new equations as follows:
\frac{\partial w}{\partial t}=k \cdot \frac{\partial ^2 w}{\partial x^2}
0=\frac{\partial ^2 v}{\partial x^2}
The second one gives you the steady-state solution, the first one the transient one. In your case the solution for the transient can be written as:
v(x)=A\cdot x + B
Using the boundary conditions, you get:
v(x)=10\cdot x

Hope this helps,
coomast

excellent answer, very detailed, thank you coomast
 
coomast said:
Hello jc2009,

The basic equation of heat conduction in 1 dimension is given as:
\frac{\partial u}{\partial t}=k \cdot \frac{\partial ^2 u}{\partial x^2}
Now if it can be assumed that the equation can be written as the sum of a transient and steady state part as follows:
u(x,t)=v(x)+w(x,t)
with v(x) the steady-state and w(x,t) the transient solution and u(x,t) the total solution, you can obtain two new equations by substituting this into the original PDE. This is thus:
\frac{\partial v}{\partial t}+\frac{\partial w}{\partial t}=k \cdot \left[\frac{\partial ^2 v}{\partial x^2}+ \frac{\partial ^2 w}{\partial x^2}\right]
Now the first term is zero because the steady-state is independent of time. This gives two new equations as follows:
\frac{\partial w}{\partial t}=k \cdot \frac{\partial ^2 w}{\partial x^2}
0=\frac{\partial ^2 v}{\partial x^2}
The second one gives you the steady-state solution, the first one the transient one. In your case the solution for the transient can be written as:
v(x)=A\cdot x + B
Using the boundary conditions, you get:
v(x)=10\cdot x

Hope this helps,
coomast

In this part :
The second one gives you the steady-state solution, the first one the transient one. In your case the solution for the transient can be written as:
v(x)=A\cdot x + B
Using the boundary conditions, you get:
v(x)=10\cdot x

I think you meant to say "THe solution for the steady state,(not the transient one) can be written as:
v(x)=A\cdot x + B
Using the boundary conditions, you get:
v(x)=10\cdot x

because you if you integrate 2 times the v(x) part using the boundary condition you get
u'' = 0 , Integrate [ u '' ] = u' = A
Integrate [u ' ] = Ax+B ----> v(x) = 10x , or this is the transient one ?
Also how exactly you got 10x? , is this because of the length of the rod ? , how do you know A = 10 , and B=0 in Ax+B ?
 
Last edited:
Hello jc2009,

Indeed I meant the steady-state solution :-)

The boundary conditions are:
v=0 at x=0
v=100 at x=10

Putting this into the solution v=A*x+B gives you the system to solve:

100=A*10+B
0=A*0+B

From which you get: v=10*x

best regards,

coomast
 

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