Superselection Rule Results from Schrodinger Equation

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the implications of superselection rules in the context of the Schrödinger equation and whether the equation can yield superpositions of states that are prohibited by these rules. Participants explore the relationship between the evolution of quantum states and the constraints imposed by superselection rules.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants propose that certain physical states cannot exist in superposition, raising questions about the applicability of superselection rules when applying the Schrödinger equation.
  • Others argue that if superselection rules are valid, the Schrödinger equation should not produce superpositions of states that belong to different superselection sectors.
  • A participant highlights that the time-dependent Schrödinger equation describes the continuous evolution of a wave function, but questions whether it accounts for superselection rules.
  • One participant presents a mathematical argument suggesting that states from different superselection sectors remain orthogonal throughout their evolution, implying that superpositions of such states cannot occur.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the relationship between the Schrödinger equation and superselection rules. There is no consensus on whether the equation can yield superpositions that violate these rules, and the discussion remains unresolved.

Contextual Notes

Participants reference the need for clarity regarding the definitions and implications of superselection rules, as well as the conditions under which the Schrödinger equation operates. There are unresolved questions about the applicability of these rules over time.

StevieTNZ
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From what I've gathered, certain physical states cannot exist in superposition. When applying the Schrödinger equation to a quantum system, do we get the relevant superselection rule results, or will it produce an answer giving two physical states in superposition, when according to the superselection rule cannot occur?
 
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StevieTNZ said:
From what I've gathered, certain physical states cannot exist in superposition. When applying the Schrödinger equation to a quantum system, do we get the relevant superselection rule results, or will it produce an answer giving two physical states in superposition, when according to the superselection rule cannot occur?
It wouldn't be much use to have a superselection rule which applies today, but doesn't apply tomorrow...
 
strangerep said:
It wouldn't be much use to have a superselection rule which applies today, but doesn't apply tomorrow...

I don't know what that response has to do with my question...

Demystifier said:
We already have a similar thread:
https://www.physicsforums.com/showthread.php?t=548541

I don't see any answer to my question in that thread. Unless I've overlooked it?
 
StevieTNZ said:
strangerep said:
It wouldn't be much use to have a superselection rule which applies today, but doesn't apply tomorrow...
I don't know what that response has to do with my question...

The (time-dependent) Schrödinger equation expresses how a wave function evolves continuously in time.

(If that's still not a relevant answer for you, perhaps you should elaborate your question in more detail?)
 
strangerep said:
The (time-dependent) Schrödinger equation expresses how a wave function evolves continuously in time.

(If that's still not a relevant answer for you, perhaps you should elaborate your question in more detail?)

But does the equation take into account superselection rules? Or will it produce superpositions of states that can't occur due to superselection rules?
 
StevieTNZ said:
But does the equation take into account superselection rules? Or will it produce superpositions of states that can't occur due to superselection rules?
By definition, if two states \psi_1,\psi_2 belong to different superselection sectors, then
<br /> \def\&lt;{\langle}<br /> \def\&gt;{\rangle}<br /> \&lt;\psi_1|A|\psi_2\&gt; = 0<br />
for all observables A. This can be extended to unitaries U = e^{iA} by expanding the exponential.

Now consider U(t) = \exp(iHt) and consider \psi_2 at a specific time, say t=0. Then we have
<br /> 0 ~=~ \&lt;\psi_1| U(t) |\psi_2(0)\&gt; ~=~ \&lt;\psi_1|\psi_2(t)\&gt;<br />
which shows that \psi_2(t) is still orthogonal to \psi_1, no matter what superposition of states \psi_2(0) evolves into during the time interval t.
 
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