The new James Bond, a revelation.

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the portrayal of James Bond in the recent films "Casino Royale" and "Quantum of Solace," focusing on character complexity, storytelling, and comparisons to previous Bond films and other franchises like Bourne. Participants express varied opinions on the direction of the Bond series, its realism, and the absence of traditional elements such as gadgets and humor.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Exploratory
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants appreciate the new Bond's complexity and dramatic character development compared to earlier portrayals, which they view as simplistic.
  • Others argue that the traditional elements of Bond, such as gadgets and humor, are essential to the franchise's identity.
  • There is a suggestion that the new Bond films aim to capture market share from the Bourne franchise, with some participants expressing mixed feelings about this comparison.
  • Some participants express strong dislike for the new films, preferring the caricatured style of earlier Bond movies.
  • A few participants highlight the realism of the new films as a positive change, while others feel it detracts from the fun of the franchise.
  • There is a debate about the effectiveness of the new Bond actor, Daniel Craig, with some praising his performance and others preferring previous actors like Pierce Brosnan.
  • One participant mentions the idea of setting a new Bond film in the original era as a potential alternative to modernization.
  • Several participants engage in a side discussion about Steve McQueen, with varying levels of familiarity with his work.
  • One participant humorously asserts that the essence of Bond is about women, gadgets, and action, dismissing the new films' focus on character development.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express a range of opinions, with no consensus on the quality or direction of the new Bond films. Some appreciate the changes, while others strongly prefer the traditional elements of the franchise.

Contextual Notes

Participants reference various aspects of the Bond franchise, including character traits, plot elements, and comparisons to other film series, indicating a diverse set of perspectives and interpretations of what constitutes a successful Bond film.

Topher925
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I just watched Casino Royal and Quantum of Solace again in chronological order and had a revelation. The first time I saw Casino Royal shortly after it was released I didn't think much of it. A year or what ever later I then saw Quantum of Solace and thought it was pretty boring. I recently watch both of them recently in chronological order and have come to realize the new Bond series if freaken awesome.

I really like how they made bond a more complex and dramatic character with a history, rather than some guy who goes around shooting people and crawling in bed with brauds. The best part though is the new story line, well I guess I should say that these movies actually HAVE a story line. All the old bond movies were just rehashes of Dr. No. Evil guy wants to take over the world, bond comes in, kicks everyone's ***, and then has lots of sex. The continuous development of the Quantum Organization and their aspirations of controlling governments and industry "from behind the curtain" instead of trying to blow up the world with a hyper death ray I think makes for a much more intriguing plot.

Anyway, the new series is very well written with an excellent story line. I guess I just had to watch it twice to realize it. It's to bad it got such bad reviews because I really hope they make a third. End of rant.
 
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"Evil guy wants to take over the world, bond comes in, kicks everyone's ***, and then has lots of sex."

I always that that was the point of bond. Or was that just me?
 
Bond without the gagets, jokes and girls is just a middle aged version of Jason Bourne.

I think that was the idea behind the new bond - to recapture some market share from the Bourne franchise.
 
But the Bourne franchise sucks and Matt Damon makes a terrible tough guy. I don't think they ever lost any of the market share to those movies.
 
I hate the new bond movies, I want caricatures not realistic heroes and villans.
 
I don't know about that...I thought The Bourne Identity was a very good action movie. Although, it was pretty much an exact copy of the 1988 version which was just as good. I'm not much of a fan of Matt Damon and I thought the rest of the Bourne series sucked, but I did like that first one.

As for the Bond movies, I personally loved all the Pierce Brosnan ones. My favorite Bond movie of all is Casino Royale, but the new one, Quantum of Solace, I thought was absolutely terrible. Casino Royale opens with an awesome intro "You know my name," has very creative graphics, the opening scene is badass..and then it goes into a non-stop action packed thrill ride...and culminates with some devilish back stabbing from a hot girl. It was perfect.

The new one, Quantum of Solace, had nothing to keep me interested...the theme song was utterly horrible and annoying, and the rest of the movie was so uninteresting that I forgot it.
 
Casino Royal and Quantum of Solace are my favorite movies of all time. I actually watched it twice in a row without getting board. The action is far superior and realistic, the scenery awesome, the plots more realistic and more interesting, the acting is top notch, it isn't corny, or predictable, and the ending is perfect for a sequel.

The old james bond films, are corny, bad acting, played out plots, etc.

One thing I appreciate about the new bond is that he isn't the typical arrogant bond. The last bond seamed like an arrogant weakling. Nothing is more corny than an arrogant weakling taking on hundreds are armed guards who have perfectly clean shots yet magically, their machine gun sprays always miss.

It wasn't until after the film ended that I thought, "Where were the gadgets". But when you think about it, the old films relied on the gadgets to make the film interesting. This film doesn't really require this aspect so much.

I'm glad they made a change from the ever so boring style that is so popular, for example, XXX with van diesel; Movies where there are ramps set up perfectly so that in the heat of the moment, someone can jump 60 feet in the air, pull out a machine gun, shoot down an F16, then jump out and grab onto a helicopter.
 
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For the record, I changed my mind to put Pierce Brosnan at the top of the list for me. That being said, I think that the new direction the Bond movies are going really let's the writers do a lot more for way better movies. I think the comparison to Bourne is a good one and hadn't really thought about that. But you are right on.

The new movies have seemed to take on a much higher level of realism (for the most part) and I think that is fantastic.

I don't know if it's just because they are newer, but after seeing the two new Bond movies, when I go back and see, even the ones I really liked before, I find myself thinking about how corny they really are.

Still...Pierce is the best IMO. I am really liking David Craig though. He's definitely the only one of the bunch that could pull the new Bond off.
 
  • #11
jarednjames said:
You mean Daniel Craig?

http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0185819/

I do admit I like his casting. He reminds me of Steve McQueen. :!) :!) :!) :!)

And I'm certainly not the only one thinking that:

http://www.news.com.au/common/imagedata/0,,6037847,00.jpg http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_DwIaqmsvR40/SW3uP4xtGHI/AAAAAAAAAps/lJV2zHPkbWk/s400/McQueen+Craig.jpg
 
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  • #12
That is one of the most effeminate outfits I've ever seen on a man...
 
  • #13
Who's steve mcqueen?
 
  • #14
Topher925 said:
Who's steve mcqueen?

http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0000537/bio" on the internet movie database.

Just to name a few of my favorite Steve McQueen appearances:
The Blob
The Great Escape
The (original) Thomas Crown Affair

Pretty interesting to see what roles he turned down too...
 
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  • #15
MATHEMATICALLY PROVEN FACTS:

FACT: Pierce Brosnan IS James Bond.

FACT: Bond movies are suppose to be about impossibly hot women, awesome gadgets, easily defeated terrorist mega-organizations, and Bond sleeping with everything. Nothing else.

FACT: The only good thing about Solace was the chick, HAWT.

FACT: If you want intrigue and developed characters and plots, don't expect it in a franchise that's done the exact opposite for almost 40 years.
 
  • #16
My friends and I were arguing about this a while back. The new James Bond is no longer James Bond. Sad but true.

Were they going to make it more realistic they could have at least kept him as a James Bond type spy instead of a black ops super killing machine. I thought maybe instead of the continual mordernization they could have gone retro and made a Bond set in the original Bond era. The whole franchise is just one continual retcon anyway.
 
  • #17
http://img190.imageshack.us/img190/1595/eventh.jpg
 
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  • #18
Nicely done, j-beast. :approve:
 
  • #19
Topher925 said:
Who's steve mcqueen?

I just died a little inside. :frown:

And for the record, Sean IS James Bond.
 
  • #20
jreelawg said:
Casino Royal and Quantum of Solace are my favorite movies of all time. I actually watched it twice in a row without getting board.
Were you hoping to get nailed? :biggrin: Couldn't resist...

jreelawg said:
The old james bond films, are corny, bad acting, played out plots, etc.

Wait. Played out plots? Isn't that a bit unfair? I mean, Bond invented those plots; it's the copycats that played them out.

It seems that's like saying Sherlock Holmes' detective stories are all clichés because they've been done a million times.
 

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