The problem of the mass of a body

  • Context: Graduate 
  • Thread starter Thread starter wLw
  • Start date Start date
  • Tags Tags
    Body Mass Physcis
Click For Summary
SUMMARY

The discussion centers on the calculation of the total mass of a spherical body using the density function ρ(r) and the implications of gravitational binding energy in the context of general relativity. It is established that while the integral of ρ provides a measure of mass, it does not account for the negative gravitational binding energy, leading to a total energy (or mass) that is less than the calculated mass M. The concept of mass is further complicated by the definitions of Komar mass and ADM mass in curved spacetime, which are essential for accurate calculations in general relativity.

PREREQUISITES
  • Understanding of density functions in physics, specifically ρ(r)
  • Familiarity with special relativity and the mass-energy equivalence principle
  • Knowledge of general relativity concepts, including gravitational binding energy
  • Basic understanding of integrals and their application in physics
NEXT STEPS
  • Study the definitions and applications of Komar mass and ADM mass in general relativity
  • Explore the concept of gravitational binding energy and its implications on mass calculations
  • Learn about the correct volume element for integrals in curved spacetime
  • Investigate the relationship between mass density ρ and total energy in various physical contexts
USEFUL FOR

Physicists, astrophysicists, and students studying general relativity and mass-energy concepts, particularly those interested in the implications of gravitational binding energy on mass calculations.

wLw
Messages
40
Reaction score
1
if we have known the density functionρ(r),and then we can calculate the total mass of a spherical body. M=integral of ρ. Now we will say that body has mass M, but I think it is wrong. according to special relativity, mass is equal to energy, so we can also say that body has total energy M,but i think it neglects the gravitational bind energy, which is negative, so the total energy(mass) of that body is smaller than M. and if your solve the Schwa. metric , there is a parameter (here we call Ms), and we define Ms as the mass(or energy) of central body , and I think it includes the energy of binding energy , so Ms is the total energy(mass )of central body, which is not defined by integral ρ, and maybe you can use integral ρ to calculate the mass(energy) of that, but it must larger than Ms. but i have read many papers and books, they all use that integral ρ to represent the mass of body, like a star How is that?、
 
Physics news on Phys.org
This is A level so you should be able to do the following:
  • What is the mass of the sun?
  • What is the gravitational binding energy of the sun?
  • What is the fractional difference in mass when you consider gravitational binding?
 
wLw said:
if we have known the density functionρ(r),and then we can calculate the total mass of a spherical body. M=integral of ρ. Now we will say that body has mass M, but I think it is wrong. according to special relativity, mass is equal to energy, so we can also say that body has total energy M,but i think it neglects the gravitational bind energy, which is negative, so the total energy(mass) of that body is smaller than M. and if your solve the Schwa. metric , there is a parameter (here we call Ms), and we define Ms as the mass(or energy) of central body , and I think it includes the energy of binding energy , so Ms is the total energy(mass )of central body, which is not defined by integral ρ, and maybe you can use integral ρ to calculate the mass(energy) of that, but it must larger than Ms. but i have read many papers and books, they all use that integral ρ to represent the mass of body, like a star How is that?、
If ##\rho## is the mass density then the calculation is correct. If it's a measure of only one aspect of mass, rest mass of the particles perhaps, then the integral will be the total of all the rest masses.

Note that in curved spacetime you will also have to use the correct volume element for your integral.
 
wLw said:
I think it includes the energy of binding energy
In general relativity the concept of mass is not defined for all spacetimes. However, for certain specific classes of spacetimes there are a couple of definitions of mass that are used. One is the Komar mass and the other is the ADM mass. See here for an overview of the issues, limitations, and derivations:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mass_in_general_relativity
 
In SR, the mass of a body is usually taken to be E_0/c^2, where E_0 is the total energy of all constituents of the body, in the rest frame of the body.
This energy includes all kinetic and potential energy, as well as \rho_m.
 
if I calculate the integral of mass density \rho, it is not the total energy of body, while is just the mass (exclude the binding energy), is it right??
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 13 ·
Replies
13
Views
2K
Replies
1
Views
1K
  • · Replies 10 ·
Replies
10
Views
2K
  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
2K
  • · Replies 9 ·
Replies
9
Views
3K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
3K
  • · Replies 13 ·
Replies
13
Views
2K
  • · Replies 7 ·
Replies
7
Views
3K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
2K
  • · Replies 17 ·
Replies
17
Views
2K