Triangle Problem: Proving DC=AC

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around a geometric problem involving triangles, specifically the relationship between the lengths of segments AC and DC in triangle ABC and triangle BDC. Participants explore the validity of a proof that claims DC equals AC, examining the assumptions and calculations involved.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant presents a series of equations attempting to prove that DC equals AC based on the areas of triangles and the Pythagorean theorem.
  • Another participant challenges the proof by questioning the definitions and assumptions, particularly regarding the area and the altitude lengths used in the calculations.
  • A later reply clarifies that BE is the altitude of triangle ABC on AC but asserts that it is incorrectly assumed to be the altitude for triangle BDC on BD.
  • One participant expresses uncertainty about where the mistake lies in the proof and seeks assistance in identifying it.
  • A subsequent post claims to have found the mistake, indicating that the assumption leading to DC equaling AC is incorrect based on the last equation derived.
  • Another participant reiterates that the area calculation for triangle BDC is incorrect, emphasizing that the height must be drawn to the vertex of the triangle.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the validity of the proof. There are competing views regarding the assumptions made about the altitudes and areas of the triangles involved.

Contextual Notes

There are limitations in the definitions of terms and the assumptions regarding the relationships between the segments and areas, which remain unresolved throughout the discussion.

raul_l
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Hi.
What's wrong here?
I'm pretty sure I did all the operations correctly so I must be making some kind of conceptual flaw.

(first see the attachment)

[tex]\triangle ABC \sim \triangle BDC[/tex]
[tex]\frac{S_{ABC}}{S_{BDC}}=\frac{AB^2}{BD^2}[/tex]
[tex]\frac{S_{ABC}}{S_{BDC}}=\frac{\frac{AC \times BE}{2}}{\frac{DC \times BE}{2}}=\frac{AC}{DC} \Rightarrow \frac{AC}{DC}=\frac{AB^2}{BD^2}[/tex]
[tex]AB^2=BE^2+AE^2=BC^2-EC^2+(AC-EC)^2=BC^2-EC^2+AC^2-2AC \times EC+EC^2=[/tex]
[tex]=BC^2+AC^2-2AC \times EC[/tex]
[tex]BD^2=BE^2+ED^2=BC^2-EC^2+(EC-DC)^2=BC^2-EC^2+EC^2-2EC \times DC+CD^2=[/tex]
[tex]=BC^2-2EC \times DC+DC^2[/tex]
[tex]\frac{AC}{DC}=\frac{BC^2+AC^2-2AC \times EC}{BC^2-2EC \times DC+DC^2}[/tex]
[tex]\frac{BC^2-2EC \times DC+DC^2}{DC}=\frac{BC^2+AC^2-2AC \times EC}{AC}[/tex]
[tex]\frac{BC^2}{DC}-2EC+DC=\frac{BC^2}{AC}+AC-2EC[/tex]
[tex]\frac{BC^2}{DC}-AC=\frac{BC^2}{AC}-DC[/tex]
[tex]\frac{BC^2-AC \times DC}{DC}=\frac{BC^2-AC \times DC}{AC} \Rightarrow DC=AC[/tex]
 

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The first thing you are doing wrong is not defining your terms! What is SABC? The area of triangle ABC? I am willing to assume that A, B, C are vertices of triangle ABC but what is E? The foot of the altitude on AC? If BE is the length of the altitude of triangle ABC on AC, what right do you have to assert that is also the length of the altitude of triangle BDC on BD?
 
Erm.. I figured all those things were obvious enough.
So yes, S[abc] is the area of ABC just as S[bdc] is the area of BDC.
E is the foot of the altitude on AC and therefore BE is its length. However, it doesn't say that BE is the length of the altitude on BD. BE is the length of the altitude on DC, because it forms a right angle with the extension of DC (right?). Therefore 1/2xDCxBE is the area of triangle BDC (which can be seen in the 3rd line).
I now it's not much fun to look through these equations but I would really appreciate it if someone could tell me where I have made a mistake. Because otherwise I would be proving that the length of a line segment is equal to the length of it subsegment (not sure whether that's the right word), in this case that the length of AC equals the length of DC.
 
What are you actually trying to do?
 
0rthodontist said:
What are you actually trying to do?

Good question :)
Sorry I didn't make that clear.
Actually, finding the mistake is the only objective here. A friend of mine showed this to me. He said that he had proven the "theorem" that the length of a line segment is equal to the length of its subsegment (by using a triangle), which was obviously a joke. However, he showed me how he had done that and asked me to find a mistake there. And so far I've got nothing.
If you look at the equations then they're all very simple operations, basically I've only used the Pythagorean theorem and a property of similar triangles. So to answer you question, the objective is to prove this "theorem" wrong.
 
I just found the answer to this problem.
In the last equation [tex]BC^2-AC \times DC=0[/tex] and therefore it would be incorrect to assume that DC=AC.
 
raul_l said:
Erm.. I figured all those things were obvious enough.
So yes, S[abc] is the area of ABC just as S[bdc] is the area of BDC.
E is the foot of the altitude on AC and therefore BE is its length. However, it doesn't say that BE is the length of the altitude on BD. BE is the length of the altitude on DC, because it forms a right angle with the extension of DC (right?). Therefore 1/2xDCxBE is the area of triangle BDC (which can be seen in the 3rd line).
I now it's not much fun to look through these equations but I would really appreciate it if someone could tell me where I have made a mistake. Because otherwise I would be proving that the length of a line segment is equal to the length of it subsegment (not sure whether that's the right word), in this case that the length of AC equals the length of DC.

No, (1/2)(DC x BE) does not equal the area of triangle BDC. The height must be a line drawn to the vertex of a triangle.

EDIT: Nevermind. I just proved that I was wrong.
 
Last edited:

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