Universe Was Born in a Black Hole?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the theory that the Universe was born in a black hole, exploring its credibility, support among physicists, and its relation to fundamental theories. Participants delve into speculative ideas about the nature of the Universe, black holes, and alternative models of cosmology.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Speculative

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants question the credibility of the theory that the Universe was born in a black hole, seeking to understand the level of support it has among physicists and its predictions within fundamental theories.
  • There are claims that the size of the Universe may correspond to the Schwarzschild radius of a black hole, suggesting a potential connection.
  • One participant speculates that the Universe is a black hole and proposes that it has always existed in a changing state rather than being created from nothing.
  • Another participant raises the question of where the black hole that supposedly birthed the Universe originated from, indicating a curiosity about the origins of such a black hole.
  • Some participants express skepticism about the theory, arguing that the metrics of black holes do not align with the expanding Universe, suggesting a fundamental difference between the two concepts.
  • There are discussions about the possibility of other black holes representing other universes and the implications of new universes appearing or happening.
  • References to Loop Quantum Gravity (LQG) and the work of physicists like M. Bojowald are made, with requests for further explanation and resources.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express a range of speculative ideas and theories, with no consensus reached on the credibility of the black hole origin theory or its implications. Some participants challenge each other's views, indicating a contested discussion.

Contextual Notes

The discussion includes a variety of speculative theories and personal interpretations, with some participants expressing concerns about the level of speculation present. There is a distinction made between observable universe, black hole universe, and infinite universe, which may reflect differing assumptions and definitions among participants.

pivoxa15
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How credible is the theory that the Universe Was Born in a Black Hole?
What proportion of physicists support this view?

Is it predicted by any fundalmental theories?

There is evidence to suggest that the size of the universe lies in the range of the Schwarzschild radius for a black hole.
 
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I have heard a theory that the Universe was born in a little piece of 'void' ...
All theories are equally valuable until one of them is proved ;)

But that's interesting... If the Universe was born in a black hole ... Where did this hole came from?
 
pivoxa15 said:
How credible is the theory that the Universe Was Born in a Black Hole?
What proportion of physicists support this view?

Is it predicted by any fundamental theories?

There is evidence to suggest that the size of the universe lies in the range of the Schwarzschild radius for a black hole.

Bart said:
I have heard a theory that the Universe was born in a little piece of 'void' ...
All theories are equally valuable until one of them is proved ;)

But that's interesting... If the Universe was born in a black hole ... Where did this hole came from?

My speculation.
IMO our universe IS a (black)hole. Earlier iN PF however this item was raised and links to articles were given with arguments that it could not be a BH. IMO our observable universe is part of its changing kernel and was phase-transformed (and not created) 14 billion years ago, i.e always existing while changing. Our hole, IMO, lives orders of magnitude longer than those 14 billion years and will continue to live orders of magnitude longer before it will be evaporated in the surrounding energysoup.THE universe (name it Googolverse, infinity verse, multiverse or whateververse) IMO contains an infinite number of concentrationholes all within a soup of energy.
I know this idea is (too?) speculative but IMO more realistic than the idea of creation out of nothing.
Maybe LQG theory of M. Bojowald can serve an entrance to further thinking.
Also among stringtheorists there are individuals who don't accept our BB as a beginning and there are also individuals amongst them finding a multiverse a reasonable boundary/environment for our universe. But personally I considder stringtheory more as a mathemathecal archive box than as a physical model which agrees reality (who am I to dare to say this?).
 
hurk4 said:
My speculation.
IMO our universe IS a (black)hole.
Now that's a brave theory. However, it might be interesting. So in your opinion where this hole we live in is located? In another universe?

hurk4 said:
THE universe (name it Googolverse, infinity verse, multiverse or whateververse) IMO contains an infinite number of concentrationholes all within a soup of energy.
Should we consider then any other black holes as other Universes?

hurk4 said:
I know this idea is (too?) speculative but IMO more realistic than the idea of creation out of nothing.
I have read somewhere that new univereses 'appear', 'happen'. What's your attitude for this?

LQG theory of M. Bojowald <- what is that? Can you serve me a link or a brief explanation?
 
pivoxa15 said:
How credible is the theory that the Universe Was Born in a Black Hole?
What proportion of physicists support this view?

Is it predicted by any fundalmental theories?

There is evidence to suggest that the size of the universe lies in the range of the Schwarzschild radius for a black hole.

I think this theory is negated by the simple fact that the metric for BHs and the present expanding universe are not the same. I don't think that BHs have a metric that incorporates expansion whereas our observable universe does.
 
pivoxa15 said:
There is evidence to suggest that the size of the universe lies in the range of the Schwarzschild radius for a black hole.

There are a lot of threads on the relation between the universe and a black hole. This particular issue is discussed in detail in this thread:

https://www.physicsforums.com/showthread.php?t=128263"
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Bart said:
Now that's a brave theory. However, it might be interesting. So in your opinion where this hole we live in is located? In another univ

Should we consider then any other black holes as other Univ

I have read somewhere that new univereses 'appear', 'happen'. What's your attitude for this?


LQG theory of M. Bojowald <- what is that? Can you serve me a link or a brief explanati

Bart,
It took some time before I could give you my reaction but here it is.

- In order not to be misunderstood, I make a distinction between observable universe (OU), Our Blackhole Universe (OBU), and The Infinite Universe (TIU)

- As we already know, inside OU there are black-holes. Their average densities are orders of magnitude higher then the average density of OU which belongs IMO to the kernel of OBU which is indeed located in OBU. The heavier black holes are the less dense they are. I question myself should there be a minimum to density, just as there is a maximum (Planck-density) for the smallest possible black hole?
- OBU, I suppose, is located in TIU (maybe parallel in a multiverse or even nested in a gigaverse or so?)
- IMO the idea of other black hole-universes can be a consequense of relative thinking.
- Blackholes are generated and are due to evaporation, so I don't exclude them.
- Just use the search option by typing Bojowald in. You also find Rovelli and Asthekar.
Marcus in "Intuitive content of Loop Gravity" gives a lot of information.
He is a specialist, not me.
 
There is far too much speculation in this thread. Unsupported personal theories are not welcome on PF. Thread closed.

- Warren
 

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