US, Japan eye China after ships barred

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the implications of China's recent military activities and its relationship with the U.S. and Japan. Participants explore concerns regarding China's missile technology advancements, military spending, and actions perceived as aggressive or unfriendly, particularly in maritime contexts. The conversation touches on geopolitical dynamics, military independence, and historical comparisons.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants express concern over China's military advancements, particularly its missile technology and naval capabilities, suggesting a shift in regional power dynamics.
  • Others argue that China's actions reflect immaturity in international relations, likening it to a child seeking attention while possessing dangerous capabilities.
  • There are claims that China's military trajectory indicates a move towards independence from U.S. military dominance, potentially leading to a new balance of power with Russia.
  • Some participants speculate on the possibility of China achieving military parity with the U.S., while acknowledging current limitations in certain military assets.
  • Concerns are raised about China's refusal to allow U.S. Navy vessels safe harbor, with differing interpretations of this act as either a breach of protocol or a lack of judgment.
  • One participant suggests that military upgrades are common among prosperous nations and downplays the threat posed by China compared to historical adversaries like the Soviet Union.
  • There is a suggestion that fears regarding China may be exaggerated, attributing them to media sensationalism rather than genuine threat assessment.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants exhibit a range of views, with no clear consensus on the implications of China's military actions or the nature of its relationship with the U.S. and Japan. Some express alarm, while others downplay the threat, indicating a contested discussion.

Contextual Notes

Participants reference historical military dynamics and current geopolitical tensions, but the discussion lacks a unified framework for assessing the implications of China's actions, leading to varied interpretations and assumptions.

Evo
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Seems China is sending signals, but what is the message?

But both Tokyo and Washington are deeply concerned about recent Chinese military activities, particularly its rapid improvements in missile technology, the modernization of its huge standing army and the expanding reach of its navy.

Early this year, tensions came to a head when China used a ground-based missile to shoot down an old weather satellite at an orbital height similar to that used by the U.S. military. It was the first-ever such test by any nation.

Tokyo and Washington are also troubled by double-digit growth in China's annual military spending, coupled with Beijing's reluctance to divulge military-related information, all of which made the Kitty Hawk incident last week even more disconcerting.

Relations between the U.S. and China have also been strained in recent months by disputes over trade and Iran's nuclear program.

Several days before the aircraft carrier and its strike group were turned back, Beijing refused to let two U.S. Navy minesweepers enter Hong Kong harbor to escape an approaching storm and refuel. The minesweepers, the Patriot and the Guardian, were instead refueled at sea and returned safely to their home port in Japan.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20071130/ap_on_re_as/china_us_navy
 
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Evo said:
Seems China is sending signals, but what is the message?
Daddy, watch me! Watch me! Watch me! Daddy! Watch me!

They are saying that they aren't mature enough yet to be a legitimate part of the international community.
 
russ_watters said:
Daddy, watch me! Watch me! Watch me! Daddy! Watch me!

They are saying that they aren't mature enough yet to be a legitimate part of the international community.
The problem is the child in this case has access to a an arsenal of deadly weapons.
 
to me this shows that china's interests are drifting from warm and welcoming to american military superiority in the region to a more luke warm, impartial stance to american military convenience.

it seems to me that china is on a path to military independence from america's global dominance of military authority. if china's military continues to grow and become more sophisticated, china and Russia could become leaders in regional politics, leaving the usa on the sidelines as conflicts are resolved without american interests being involved.
 
It would appear that China is on its way to parity with the US, something the Bush administration would like to prevent, but that is unlikely. Certainly, AFAWK, China lacks large nuclear powered carriers and submarines, but in other areas, they are probably not far behind.

Could they surround Taiwan? Then what?

Meanwhile, back in Washington :rolleyes:
 
devil-fire, I guess you didn't read the article. They've made serious breaches in maritime protocol by denying safe harbor. Lack of judgement or act of aggression? Not something a "friendly" country would do.
 
Evo said:
devil-fire, I guess you didn't read the article. They've made serious breaches in maritime protocol by denying safe harbor. Lack of judgement or act of aggression? Not something a "friendly" country would do.

there could have been a legitimate or even illegitimate reason china refused harbor, or there could have been no reason at all. its looking like china isn't about to give an explanation one way or another.

its definitely an unfriendly act. i don't see how it would be an act of aggression though
 
This is nothing new, as nations become more prosperous they upgrade their military. The UK has weapons on par with the U.S., Nuclear weapons, and nuclear subs, but no one is worried about that. During the Cold War the Soviet Union and U.S. had nuclear missiles pointed at each other, but WWIII did not break out, modern China is nowhere near the threat as the Soviet Union was. The likelihood of a serious conflict with China is close to none, especially considering the economic incentives that China gains by being friendly to the U.S. This is just mass paranoia, by a liberal media attempting to stir the pot.
 

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