Wave Functions: Understanding Moving Particles

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the relationship between wave packets and wave functions in quantum mechanics, particularly in the context of moving particles. Participants explore concepts such as the de Broglie hypothesis, the Schrödinger equation, and the implications of wave functions and wave packets in representing particles.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants assert that a wave packet represents a wave function, emphasizing that it is a linear combination of different free particle solutions.
  • Others highlight that while stationary solutions of the form e^{ikx-iwt} exist, they are unphysical and cannot represent real particles.
  • A participant introduces the semi-classical approximation, noting that wave functions can be treated as wave packets, with group velocity corresponding to particle velocity and phase velocity to momentum.
  • There is mention of a dispersion relation that prevents wave packets from exceeding the speed of light, paralleling constraints on classical particles.
  • Questions arise regarding the interpretation of the de Broglie wavelength associated with moving particles and its compatibility with wave packets.
  • Concerns are raised about the use of unnormalizable wave functions in deriving the Schrödinger equation, questioning the physical realizability of such functions.
  • Some participants discuss the nature of quantum particles being in superpositions of states, contrasting them with classical particles.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

The discussion reveals multiple competing views regarding the relationship between wave packets and wave functions, the implications of the de Broglie hypothesis, and the physical realizability of certain wave functions. No consensus is reached on these issues.

Contextual Notes

Participants express uncertainty about the assumptions underlying the de Broglie hypothesis and the implications of using certain wave functions in quantum mechanics. The discussion highlights the complexity of these concepts and the need for further clarification.

manofphysics
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We know, a particle may be represented by a wave PACKET which has a group velocity.
But most of the time, we are concerned with the wave FUNCTION of a moving particle.
In the de broglie hypothesis, it is said that a wave equation y=e^i(kx-wt), CANNOT be associated with a moving particle as the phase velocity comes out greater than that of light.
But , in *deriving* / or arriving at the schroedinger's eqn, we assume a wave function of a free particle as the gen. wave traveling wave eqn.(of course, we assume it to be complex)
I don't know, I am getting confused between the relationship between the wave packet of a particle and it's wave function.
 
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manofphysics said:
We know, a particle may be represented by a wave PACKET which has a group velocity.
But most of the time, we are concerned with the wave FUNCTION of a moving particle.
In the de broglie hypothesis, it is said that a wave equation y=e^i(kx-wt), CANNOT be associated with a moving particle as the phase velocity comes out greater than that of light.
But , in *deriving* / or arriving at the schroedinger's eqn, we assume a wave function of a free particle as the gen. wave traveling wave eqn.(of course, we assume it to be complex)
I don't know, I am getting confused between the relationship between the wave packet of a particle and it's wave function.


A wave packet is a wave function. we just say "packet" so that you remember it is made up of a linear combination of different free particle solutions.

E.g., If the free particle hamiltonian is given by
[tex] H=(-1/(2m))\frac{d^2}{dx^2}[/tex]
Then, we have stationary solutions of the form [itex]e^{ikx-iwt}[/itex] for any k, as long as w=k^2/(2m). But these are unphysical (unnormalizable) solutions and can not represent the wave function of a real particle.

On the other hand a linear combination of these plane wave can be normalized and has the form:
[tex] \Psi(x,t)=\sum_{k}a_k e^{ikx-iw_kt}\;.[/tex]

Which you can call a "wave packet" or a "wave function".
 
The approximation of quantum mechanics in which particles wave-functions can be treated as wave packets (also caleed quasi-particles) is called the semi-classical approximation. The group velocity corresponds to the particle concept of velocity, and the phase velocity corresponds to the particle concept of momentum. Just like the energy and momentum of classical particles are constrained by the equation E2 - p2 = m2, the angular frequency and wave numbers of these particle-like wave packets satisfy the relation

[tex]\omega^2 - k^2 = \frac{m^2}{\hbar^2}[/tex]

(called a dispersion relation). This prevents the wave packets from having a group velocity greater than light, just like E2 - p2 = m2 prevents ordinary particles from having a velocity greater than light. There are hypothetical particles called tachyons, whose dispersion relation is

[tex]\omega^2 - k^2 = -\frac{m^2}{\hbar^2}[/tex]

and which have a group velocity which exceeds c.
 
Last edited:
I'd like to ask a question here.
1)I have understood that a "packet" localises the particle. It is a superposition of waves of different wave lengths. But De broglie hypothesis says that a moving particle has with it associated a single wave length h/mv. How is this possible?
And then how do you explain the successful interpretation of this "single wavelength=h/mv"concept in the Davisson Germer experiment
2)And then, why do we use as the wave function[tex]\Psi=e^{-i(kx-wt)}[/tex] of a "FREE particle" while arriving at the Schrödinger's time dependent formula. The assumption itself is wrong since this is not physically realizable(unnormalizable) wave function of a particle ?
 
Last edited:
manofphysics said:
I'd like to ask a question here.
1)I have understood that a "packet" localises the particle. It is a superposition of waves of different wave lengths. But De broglie hypothesis says that a moving particle has with it associated a single wave length h/mv. How is this possible?

In general, quantum particles do not have a definite energy and momentum, like classical particles do. They will be in a superposition of such states (with definite E and P). These are the states that the de Broglie's formula talks about. These states are plane-wave wave functions, characterized by their a definite wave number and an angular frequency.
 

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