What are Integrals and what do they tell you?

  • Context: High School 
  • Thread starter Thread starter thharrimw
  • Start date Start date
  • Tags Tags
    Integrals
Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the concept of integrals in mathematics, exploring their definitions, applications, and significance. Participants touch on historical perspectives, mathematical properties, and practical uses in various contexts, including physics and geometry.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants suggest that integrals can be understood as linear operators, extending discrete operations to continuous ones.
  • Others argue that integrals primarily represent the area under a curve, specifically the area enclosed by a function and the x-axis.
  • A participant mentions the historical context of integrals, linking them to problems of finding tangents and areas, and references the fundamental theorem of calculus.
  • Some contributions highlight practical applications of integrals, such as calculating distance from velocity graphs or determining volumes and surface areas of geometric shapes.
  • There are questions raised about the significance of knowing the area represented by an integral, with responses emphasizing its role in summing infinitely small portions and its applications in physics.
  • Participants note that the first uses of integrals were to compute areas under curves and volumes of solids, like spheres.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree on the foundational role of integrals in representing areas and their applications in various fields. However, there is no consensus on the best way to conceptualize or explain integrals, leading to multiple competing views and interpretations.

Contextual Notes

Some discussions involve assumptions about the definitions of integrals and their applications, which may not be universally accepted or fully resolved within the thread.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be of interest to students and educators in mathematics and physics, as well as individuals seeking to understand the foundational concepts of calculus and its applications.

thharrimw
Messages
114
Reaction score
0
what are Integrals and what do they tell you?
 
Physics news on Phys.org
It might help to have a look at an introductory textbook to get an idea. That's what they've been written for after all. :smile:
 
At about the time of the renaissance, there were two major problems being looked at by mathematicians: finding the tangent line to a curve (and so approximate some complicated function by a linear approximation) and finding the area of general two dimensional figure. The derivative solves the first of those problems and the integral solves the second. One reason why Newton and Leibniz are considered the founders of calculus, even though others had come up with formulas very similar to theirs is that they showed "the fundamental theorem of calculus", that these two problem are, in a sense, inverse to one another.
 
I like to think of them as linear operators.
L(a*f+b*g)=a*L(f)+b*L(g)
thus extenting a discrete opperator to a continuous one
L(lim f)=lim L(f)
thus say we can integtrate step functions
L(f)=sum f(xi*)[xi+1-xi]
we can integrate limits of step functions
using properties like
f<g ->L(f)<L(g)
L(a*f+b*g)=a*L(f)+b*L(g)
L(1)=b-a (ie the width of the inteval under consideration)
 
so integrals tell you the area of any given function
 
thharrimw said:
so integrals tell you the area of any given function

Well, sort of, yes.
 
how does knowing the area of a equation help you
 
thharrimw said:
how does knowing the area of a equation help you

this doesn't really make sense!

-the definite integral
[tex]\int_a^{b}f(x)dx[/tex] is the area that is enclosed by the graph of the function f, and the x axis, in this case!
 
thharrimw said:
how does knowing the area of a equation help you

It's just just a representation of area in the physical sense. When we talk about integration in the simplest sense, we're talking about taking a lot of infinitely small portions of something and summing them together.

In calculus you think of an integral as the change in the value of a function whose derivative is given. Or you might think about it as the area to a particular equation. f(x)=sqrt(1-x^2) from -1 to 1, gives you an area of pi/2 for instance.

In physics you might think of integration as an infinite summation of a uniform line of charge on a particular point in space. Or as a method to find a change in position knowing only a velocity.
 
Last edited:
  • #10
thharrimw said:
how does knowing the area of a equation help you


Well, Say you're running and you want to see how far you have traveled, and you have a graph of your (Y)Velocity as (X)Time, but you have traveled in acceleration, so the normal approach of counting the squares under the line doesn't work. In this case you can:
-Proceed to count squares (good luck with that).

-whip out an integral and get it done like a man.
 
  • #11
thharrimw said:
how does knowing the area of a equation help you

If you were asking, when is it beneficial to be able to evaluate the integral of a function?, then the answer would be - many cases =] Integrals let you show that the volume of a sphere is [tex]\frac{4}{3} \pi r^3[/tex] and its surface area is [tex]4\pi r^2[/tex], as well as many other things.
 
  • #12
the first use of integrals was to compute the area under a parabola and the volume of a sphere.
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 27 ·
Replies
27
Views
3K
  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
3K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
3K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
3K
  • · Replies 10 ·
Replies
10
Views
3K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
3K
  • · Replies 12 ·
Replies
12
Views
3K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
3K
  • · Replies 15 ·
Replies
15
Views
5K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
7K