What does 3-dimensional space deform into, in the presence of gravity?

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    3d Gravity Space
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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around the nature of 3-dimensional space in the presence of gravity and what it deforms into, particularly in relation to concepts of curvature and higher dimensions. Participants explore the implications of visualizing space and the validity of references used to support claims.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • The original poster (OP) suggests that if 2-dimensional space deforms into the 3rd dimension, then 3-dimensional space might deform into the 4th dimension, although they express uncertainty about this visualization.
  • Some participants argue that the curvature of space is intrinsic and does not deform "into" anything, asserting that in 3-dimensional space, there is no deformation into another dimension.
  • Concerns are raised about the validity of using pop science sources, specifically mentioning Brian Greene's work, which some participants believe leads to misunderstandings about the concepts discussed.
  • A participant emphasizes the importance of relying on textbooks and peer-reviewed papers over popular science references.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express disagreement regarding the interpretation of space deformation and the validity of references. There is no consensus on the nature of the deformation of space or the appropriateness of the sources cited.

Contextual Notes

There are limitations in the discussion regarding the assumptions made about dimensionality and the interpretations of curvature. The reliance on pop science references is also a point of contention.

jaketodd
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I have no expertise in this area, other than rudimentary concepts. The following might apply if the visualization of space, as depicted below, represents actual reality, but I don't know for sure. Please help me understand better, you guys!

2-dimensional space
The curvatures deform into the 3rd dimension, as can be seen in the picture below.

So in 3-dimensional space, what does space deform into? 4th!?
We can't even visualize it! Unless it doesn't deform into the 4th, but instead just stretches space, without a deformation into a 4th. See another picture below.

This is mentioned by Brian Greene, notable for his documentary The Elegant Universe. He's mostly about string theory but poses this question as well.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Curved_space

1687711776058.png


1687711851246.png
 
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jaketodd said:
2-dimensional space
The curvatures deform into the 3rd dimension
No, they don't. The third dimension in the picture has no relationship to any dimension in reality. A curved space doesn't deform "into" anything. The curvature is intrinsic.

jaketodd said:
So in 3-dimensional space, what does space deform into?
Nothing. See above.

jaketodd said:
This is mentioned by Brian Greene, notable for his documentary The Elegant Universe.
This is a pop science source and is not a valid reference. In fact, Greene's pop science books and videos are particularly bad because of the number of misunderstandings they create among unsuspecting lay people. We have had many past PF threads on this.
 
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@jaketodd, you apparently have failed to take my advice to learn from textbooks and peer-reviewed papers instead of pop science sources. You really, really, really, really need to take it.
 
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The OP is based on a misconception obtained from an invalid pop science reference. Thread closed.
 

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