What is the mistake in my coordinate transformation for Theorema Egregium?

  • Context: Graduate 
  • Thread starter Thread starter Simone Furcas
  • Start date Start date
  • Tags Tags
    Metric
Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around a coordinate transformation related to Theorema Egregium, focusing on the derivation of a new metric and the verification of its consistency with the theorem. Participants explore the implications of their calculations and the correctness of their matrix operations.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant presents a metric transformation and expresses uncertainty about the correctness of their derived metric, questioning the validity of their calculations involving the Jacobian.
  • Another participant points out an error in matrix multiplication, suggesting that the multiplication of diagonal matrices is commutative, which could affect the results.
  • A participant acknowledges a mistake in their earlier calculations regarding the metric and the Jacobian, leading to a revised expression.
  • Further clarification is provided by a participant who identifies a mistake related to using the transpose instead of the inverse of the Jacobian in their calculations.
  • One participant claims to have resolved the issue, indicating that the mistake was identified and corrected.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express uncertainty and disagreement regarding the correctness of the matrix operations and the implications for the metric transformation. The discussion includes multiple viewpoints on the calculations, and while one participant claims to have solved the exercise, the overall consensus on the correctness of the initial claims remains unresolved.

Contextual Notes

Limitations include potential misunderstandings of matrix operations, the dependence on the correct application of the Jacobian, and unresolved aspects of the metric transformation process.

Simone Furcas
Messages
10
Reaction score
0
I have ##ds^2=\cos^2(v)du^2 + dv^2## , i take a coordinate transformation x=u and cos(v)=##\frac{1}{(cosh(y))}##, I have to find a new metric with this coordinate transformation and proof it is in agreement with Theorema Egregium. ##ds^2=\frac{dx^2}{(cosh^2(y)}) +\frac{dy^2 }{(y^2(1-y^2))}## is my new metric . I used the jacobian to proof the second point, ##J=\begin{pmatrix} 1 & 0 \\ 0 & \frac{-1}{y(1-y^2)^(1/2)} \end{pmatrix}##, so ##j^-1 * \begin{pmatrix} \frac{1}{cosh^2{y}} & 0 \\ 0 & \frac{1}{y^2(1-y^2)} \end{pmatrix} *j ## = ## \begin{pmatrix} \frac{1}{cosh^2{y}} & 0 \\ 0 & (\frac{1}{y^2(1-y^2)})^2 \end{pmatrix}##
I know cos(v)=##\frac{1}{(cosh(y))}## so the first part is ok, the second ##(\frac{1}{(y^2(1-y^2)})^2##=1 i think is not true...
What is my mistake? Does someone could help me?
 
Last edited:
Physics news on Phys.org
Simone Furcas said:
I have ##ds^2=\cos^2(v)du^2 + dv^2## , i take a coordinate transformation x=u and cos(v)=##\frac{1}{(cosh(y))}##, I have to find a new metric with this coordinate transformation and proof it is in agreement with Theorema Egregium. ##ds^2=\frac{dx^2}{(cosh^2(y)}) +\frac{dy^2 }{(y^2(1-y^2))}## is my new metric . I used the jacobian to proof the second point, ##J=\begin{pmatrix} 1 & 0 \\ 0 & \frac{-1}{y(1-y^2)^(1/2)} \end{pmatrix}##, so ##j^-1 * \begin{pmatrix} \frac{1}{cosh^2{y}} & 0 \\ 0 & \frac{1}{y^2(1-y^2)} \end{pmatrix} *j ## = ## \begin{pmatrix} \frac{1}{cosh^2{y}} & 0 \\ 0 & (\frac{1}{y^2(1-y^2)})^2 \end{pmatrix}##
I know cos(v)=##\frac{1}{(cosh(y))}## so the first part is ok, the second ##(\frac{1}{(y^2(1-y^2)})^2##=1 i think is not true...
What is my mistake? Does someone could help me?
I did a mistake, ##ds^2=\frac{dx^2}{(cosh^2(y)}) +\frac{dy^2 }{cosh{y}}##, ##J=\begin{pmatrix} 1 & 0 \\ 0 & \frac{1}{cosh{y}} \end{pmatrix}##, so ##j^-1 * \begin{pmatrix} \frac{1}{cosh^2{y}} & 0 \\ 0 & \frac{1}{cosh{y}}\end{pmatrix} *j ## = ## \begin{pmatrix} \frac{1}{cosh^2{y}} & 0 \\ 0 & (\frac{1}{cosh{y}})^4 \end{pmatrix}##
Does someone have any ideas?
 
That matrix multiplication is wrong. Since these are diagonal matrices multiplication is commutative so J^{-1}MJ= (J^{-1}J)M= M for any matrix, M.
 
Simone Furcas said:
I did a mistake, ##ds^2=\frac{dx^2}{(cosh^2(y)}) +\frac{dy^2 }{cosh{y}}##, ##J=\begin{pmatrix} 1 & 0 \\ 0 & \frac{1}{cosh{y}} \end{pmatrix}##, so ##j^-1 * \begin{pmatrix} \frac{1}{cosh^2{y}} & 0 \\ 0 & \frac{1}{cosh{y}}\end{pmatrix} *j ## = ## \begin{pmatrix} \frac{1}{cosh^2{y}} & 0 \\ 0 & (\frac{1}{cosh{y}})^4 \end{pmatrix}##
Does someone have any ideas?
##j^T * \begin{pmatrix} \frac{1}{cosh^2{y}} & 0 \\ 0 & \frac{1}{cosh{y}}\end{pmatrix} *j ## = ## \begin{pmatrix} \frac{1}{cosh^2{y}} & 0 \\ 0 & (\frac{1}{cosh{y}})^4 \end{pmatrix}## there was a mistake, it was the transpose not the inverse.
 
I solved it.
Simone Furcas said:
##j^T * \begin{pmatrix} \frac{1}{cosh^2{y}} & 0 \\ 0 & \frac{1}{cosh{y}}\end{pmatrix} *j ## = ## \begin{pmatrix} \frac{1}{cosh^2{y}} & 0 \\ 0 & (\frac{1}{cosh{y}})^4 \end{pmatrix}## there was a mistake, it was the transpose not the inverse.
I solved the exercise.
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 21 ·
Replies
21
Views
4K
  • · Replies 0 ·
Replies
0
Views
2K
  • · Replies 23 ·
Replies
23
Views
6K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
2K
  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
2K
  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
2K
  • · Replies 10 ·
Replies
10
Views
1K
  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
3K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
3K
Replies
2
Views
1K