What Is the Structure of This Quotient Group?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the structure of a quotient group derived from the free group on two letters, specifically focusing on proving the solvability of the group and determining its isomorphism class. Participants explore theoretical aspects of group theory, including derived series and automorphisms.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants propose that the group \( G \) is solvable by identifying its derived series, suggesting that \( G' = \langle a \rangle \) and that the second derived group is trivial.
  • Others argue that the subgroup \( \langle b \rangle \cong \mathbb{Z}_6 \) acts on \( \langle a \rangle \cong \mathbb{Z}_7 \) via inner automorphisms, leading to the conclusion that \( G \) is isomorphic to a semidirect product \( \mathbb{Z}_6 \rtimes_{\alpha} \mathbb{Z}_7 \).
  • A later reply questions the choice of automorphisms and suggests that the action of \( \mathbb{Z}_6 \) may effectively reduce to an action of \( \mathbb{Z}_3 \) and a trivial action of \( \mathbb{Z}_2 \).
  • Participants discuss the need to eliminate other potential isomorphism classes for \( G \), listing several groups and their properties that contradict the characteristics of \( G \).
  • One participant details a method to count the number of elements of order 2 in \( G \), concluding that \( b^3 \) is the only element of order 2, which influences the classification of \( G \).
  • Another participant suggests that the automorphism \( \phi_1 \) defined by \( \phi_1(x) = x \) and \( \phi_1(y) = y^6 \) could be an outer automorphism, contingent on \( y^6 \) not being conjugate to \( y \).

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the classification of \( G \) and the implications of the derived series. While some agree on the solvability of \( G \), there is no consensus on the exact isomorphism class, with multiple competing hypotheses remaining unresolved.

Contextual Notes

Limitations include the dependence on specific definitions of automorphisms and the unresolved nature of certain mathematical steps in proving the isomorphism class of \( G \).

Deveno
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You are given a group as a quotient of the free group on two letters, a and b.

the kernel of the surjective homomorphism $F_2 \to G$ is generated by:

$\{a^7,b^6,a^4ba^{-1}b^{-1}\}$

a) prove $G$ is solvable by identifying the derived series:

$G' = [G,G] > G^{\prime \prime} = [G',G'] > \dots $

b) determine the isomorphism class of $G$

(hint: you have 6 to choose from)
 
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Deveno said:
You are given a group as a quotient of the free group on two letters, a and b.

the kernel of the surjective homomorphism $F_2 \to G$ is generated by:

$\{a^7,b^6,a^4ba^{-1}b^{-1}\}$

a) prove $G$ is solvable by identifying the derived series:

$G' = [G,G] > G^{\prime \prime} = [G',G'] > \dots $ (I have removed a prime from [G,G'] to make it [G,G]. I hope that's right.)

b) determine the isomorphism class of $G$

(hint: you have 6 to choose from)
It is over 50 years since I took a course on group theory, so this has been a tough exercise for dormant brain cells.

From the relation $a^4ba^{-1}b^{-1} = e$ ($e$ being the identity element of $G$), it follows that $ba = a^4b$. So any word in $a$ and $b$ can be transformed to one of the form $a^kb^l$ by pushing all the $b$s to the right. Furthermore, each time you push a power $b$ past a power of $a$, the power of $b$ will not change, but the power of $a$ will be multiplied by 4. If you apply this process repeatedly to a commutator, the powers of $b$ will eventually all cancel and you will be left with a power of $a$. In particular, $aba^{-1}b^{-1} = a^4$, so $a^4$ is a commutator. Therefore $(a^4)^2 = a^8 = a \in [G,G]$, and it follows that $G' = \langle a\rangle$, the subgroup generated by $a$. Since that is abelian, the second derived group will just be $\{e\}.$

Next, $bab^{-1} = a^4$, which means that the subgroup $\langle b\rangle \cong \mathbb{Z}_6$ acts by inner automorphisms on the subgroup $\langle a\rangle \cong\mathbb{Z}_7$, and so $G$ is (isomorphic to) a semidirect product $\mathbb{Z}_6 \rtimes_{\alpha}\mathbb{Z}_7$, where $\alpha$ is the action given by $\alpha(a) = bab^{-1}.$ Use of the relation $ba = a^4b$ shows that $\alpha^3 = \text{id.}$, which makes it look as though the action of $\mathbb{Z}_6$ is effectively an action of $\mathbb{Z}_3$ together with a trivial action of $\mathbb{Z}_2.$ So I am guessing that $G$ is isomorphic to the direct product $G = H\times\mathbb{Z}_2$, where $H$ is the nonabelian group of order 21. But I don't have the technical knowhow to prove that properly.
 
awesome. you're almost there!

let $H = \langle x,y: x^3 = y^7 = e,\ yx = xy^2\rangle$

it should be clear this gives a non-abelian group of order 21.

now you just have to pick a suitable choice for $a,b$ in $H \times \Bbb Z_2$ and show that these satisfy the defining relations of $G$.

OR:

eliminate the other 5 possibilities:

$G \cong \Bbb Z_{42}$ (but $G$ is non-abelian)
$G \cong D_{42}$ (but $G$ has an element of order 6)
$G \cong D_{14} \times \Bbb Z_3$ (has 7 elements of order 2)
$G \cong D_6 \times \Bbb Z_7$ (has 3 elements of order 2)
$G \cong \Bbb Z_2 \rtimes_{\phi} H$ (here H is the normal subgroup, for clarification).

the last one is tricky, to check the order of elements one needs to find an outer automorphism (which will be $\phi_1$) of $H$ of order 2 (clearly no inner automorphism will do).

perhaps:

$\phi_1(x) = x$
$\phi_1(y) = y^6$

might be a good choice (provided, of course, $y^6$ is not conjugate to $y$).

if one takes the latter approach, it might be fruitful to ask:

which elements of $G$ have order 2?
 
so...can anyone confirm Opalg's guess?
 
as hinted above, Opalg is indeed correct. let's prove this 2 ways, the easy way, and the hard way. the easy way first:

in $H \times \Bbb Z_2$, set:

$a = (y,0),\ b = (x,1)$

then $a^7 = (y^7,0) = (e,0)$ the identity, and

$b^2 = (x^2,0)$
$b^3 = (e,1)$
$b^6 = (e,1)^2 = (e^2,1+1) = (e,0)$

so $a$ is an element of order 7 and $b$ is an element of order 6.

now $ba = (x,0)*(y,0) = (xy,0)$

while $a^4b = (y^2,0)*(x,0) = (y^4x,0)$

recall that in $H$: $yx = xy^2$, so:

$y^4x = y^3(yx) = y^3(xy^2)= y^2(yx)y^2 = (y^2)(xy^4)$
$ = y(yx)y^4 = y(xy^2)y^4 = (yx)y^6 = (xy^2)y^6 = xy^8 = xy$

hence $a^4b = ba$.

*****************
now the hard way. we're going to count the number of elements of $G$ of order 2. one observation makes this somewhat easier:

$(a^jb^k)^2 = a^tb^{2k}$ for some integer t, since we don't alter the powers of b when we exchange $ba$ for $a^4b$, only the powers of a.

so if $(a^jb^k)^2 = e$ then $k = 3$, since $\langle a \rangle \cap \langle b \rangle = \{e\}$ (we can rule out $k = 0$ since $a$ is of order 7).

thus we have only six elements to check (we know $b^3$ is of order 2).

$(ab^3)^2 = ab^2(ba)b^3 = (ab^2a^4)b^4 = (ab)(ba)(a^3b^4)$
$= (ab)(a^4b)(a^3b^4) = (aba^4)(ba)(a^2b^4) = (aba^4)(a^4b)(a^2b^4)$
$= (aba)(ba)(ab^4) = (aba)(a^4b)(ab^4) = (aba^5)(ba)b^4 = (aba^5)(a^4b)b^4$
$= (aba^2)b^5 = a(ba)(ab^5) = a(a^4b)(ab^5) = a^5(ba)b^5 = a^5(a^4b)b^5$
$= a^2 \neq e$

$(a^2b^3)^2 = (a^2b^2)(ba)(ab^3) = (a^2b^2a^4)(ba)b^3 = (a^2b^2a)b^4$
$= (a^2b)(ba)b^4 = (a^2ba^4)b^5 = a^2(ba)(a^3b^5) = a^6(ba)(a^2b^5)$
$= a^3(ba)(ab^5) = bab^5 = a^4 \neq e$

$(a^3b^3)^2 = (a^3b^2)(ba)(a^2b^3) = (a^3b^2a^4)(ba)(ab^3)$
$= (a^3b^2a)(ba)b^3 = (a^3b^2a^5)b^4 = (a^3b)(ba)(a^4b^4)$
$= (a^3ba^4)(ba)(a^3b^4) = (a^3ba)(ba)(a^2b^4) = (a^3ba^5)(ba)(ab^4)$
$= (a^3ba^2)(ba)b^4 = (a^3ba^6)b^5 = a^3(ba)(a^5b^5) = (ba)(a^4b^5)$
$= a^4(ba)(a^3b^5) = a(ba)(a^2b^5) = a^5(ba)(ab^5) = a^2(ba)b^5 = a^6 \neq e$

$(a^4b^3)^2 = (a^4b^2)(ba)(a^3b^3) = (a^4b^2a^4)(ba)(a^2b^3) = (a^4b^2a)(ba)(ab^3)$
$= (a^4b^2a^5)(ba)b^3 = (a^4b^2a^2)b^4 = (a^4b)(ba)(ab^4) = (a^4ba^4)(ba)b^4$
$= (a^4ba)b^5 = a^4(ba)b^5 = a \neq e$

$(a^5b^3)^2 = (a^5b^2)(ba)(a^4b^3) = (a^5b^2a^4)(ba)(a^3b^3)$
$= (a^5b^2a)(ba)(a^2b^3) = (a^5b^2a^5)(ba)(ab^3) = (a^5b^2a^2)(ba)b^4$
$= (a^5b^2a^6)b^4 = (a^5b)(ba)(a^5b^4) = (a^5ba^4)(ba)(a^4b^4)$
$= (a^5ba)(ba)(a^3b^4) = (a^5ba^5)(ba)(a^2b^4) = (a^5ba^2)(ba)(ab^4)$
$= (a^5ba^6)(ba)b^4 = (a^5ba^3)b^5 = a^5(ba)(a^2b^5) = a^2(ba)(ab^5)$
$= a^6(ba)b^5 = a^3 \neq e$

finally (jeepers!):

$(a^6b^3)^2 = (a^6b^2)(ba)(a^5b^3) = (a^6b^2a^4)(ba)(a^4b^3)$
$= (a^6b^2a)(ba)(a^3b^3) = (a^6b^2a^5)(ba)(a^2b^3) = (a^6b^2a^2)(ba)(ab^3)$
$= (a^6b^2a^6)(ba)b^3 = (a^6b^2a^3)b^4 = (a^6b)(ba)(a^2b^4) = (a^6ba^4)(ba)(ab^4)$
$= (a^6ba)(ba)b^4 = (a^6ba^5)b^5 = a^6(ba)(a^4b^5) = a^3(ba)(a^3b^5)$
$= (ba)(a^2b^5) = a^4(ba)(ab^5) = a(ba)b^5 = a^5 \neq e$

this means that $b^3$ is the SOLE element of $G$ of order 2. this rules out 3 of the other 5 possibilities, and $G$ is non-abelian, so either:

$G \cong H \times \Bbb Z_2$, or:
$G \cong H \rtimes_\phi \Bbb Z_2$

of course to define the multiplication of the last group explicitly, we need to find an outer automorphism of $H$ of order 2.

it's clear that:

$\phi_1(x) = x$
$\phi_1(y) = y^6$

will be such an automorphism, provided $y^6$ is not some conjugate of $y$. so let's look at the conjugacy class of $y$.

note that:

$(x^k)(y^m)y(y^{-m})(x^{-k}) = (x^k)y(x^k)^{-1}$

so we need only conjugate $y$ by powers of $x$ to determine its conjugacy class. so:

$xyx^{-1} = xyx^2 = x(yx)x = x(xy^2)x = x^2y(yx) = x^2(yx)y^2= y^4$.
$x^2yx^{-2} = x(xyx^{-1})x^{-1} = xy^4x^{-1} = (xyx^{-1})^4 = y^{16} = y^2$.

so the conjugacy class of $y$ is $\{y,y^2,y^4\}$.

thus our automorphism is indeed outer. if we can establish that this semi-direct product group has more than one element of order 2, it cannot possibly be isomorphic to $G$.

clearly $(e,1)$ has order 2:

$(e,1)*(e,1) = (e\phi_1(e),1+1) = (e,0)$

and:

$(y,1)*(y,1) = (y\phi_1(y),1+1) = (y(y^6),0) = (e,0)$

and we are done (it turns out that ALL of the elements of the subgroup $\langle y \rangle \times \{0\}$ are of order 2).

of course, we might want to show that indeed $H \times \Bbb Z_2$ only has one element of order 2 as well, just as a sanity check:

suppose $(g,k)$ has order 2. this means:

$(g^2,k+k) = (0,e)$

since $H$ HAS no elements of order 2 (21 is odd), this forces $g = e$, so the only possibilities are:

$(e,1)$ and $(e,0)$

and only $(e,1)$ has order 2 (the other element is the identity).
 

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