What is the true vacuum and does it exist in our expanding universe?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the concept of a "true vacuum" in the context of an expanding universe. Participants explore the definitions of vacuum, the existence of gravitational fields, and the implications of spacetime curvature. The conversation touches on theoretical aspects of cosmology, quantum fields, and the nature of the universe, including its potential finiteness or infiniteness.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Technical explanation

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants propose that a vacuum should be defined as a region devoid of particles, while others clarify that a vacuum still contains quantum fields and spacetime.
  • There is a question about whether it is possible to create a region of space with absolutely zero gravitational field, with some arguing that this is not physically clear.
  • One participant suggests that the perfect true vacuum could exist outside the observable universe, but others refute this by stating that the universe is expanding everywhere and is likely spatially infinite.
  • There is a discussion about whether fields can exist in regions with zero particle count, with some affirming that fields can exist independently of particles.
  • Participants debate the finiteness or infiniteness of the universe, with some asserting that the total universe (observable plus non-observable) may be finite, while others argue that this remains unanswerable.
  • One participant challenges the logical coherence of the concept of "nothing" existing in a physical vacuum, suggesting that such a notion is illogical.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express multiple competing views regarding the nature of vacuum, the existence of gravitational fields, and the structure of the universe. The discussion remains unresolved on several points, particularly concerning the finiteness of the universe and the definition of vacuum.

Contextual Notes

Limitations include the dependence on varying definitions of vacuum and gravitational fields, as well as unresolved assumptions about the universe's structure and the implications of quantum field theory.

  • #31
I think, only the observable Universe can be said as finite but unbounded. So, infinite Universe (that's it, if an imaginary object keep moving straight forever it will never return to its starting point) is more likely than the finite yet unbounded Universe.

Sometimes, if I want to show that space is indeed "something" rather than "nothing", I will make an assumption by imagining a lone object without anything else. So, hypothetically this lone object would be fully static because motion is relative. But as these terms, "static" and "motion" are both relational concepts, then in reality we can't really say that this hypothetical lone object is static. But nevermind, for the sake of this imaginary assumption, the lone object would be static. This is sometimes begging the question, why makes this lone object to remains stationary in its position?
 
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  • #32
Mohd Abdullah said:
I think, only the observable Universe can be said as finite but unbounded.

This is not correct. Our observable universe is finite because the age of the universe is finite, so light has only had a finite time to get to us from distant parts of the universe. But it is not "unbounded" in the sense in which that term is normally used--it is not a 3-sphere. It's an ordinary 3-volume that is part of something larger--we just don't know whether the something larger is an infinite space or a finite but unbounded space like a 3-sphere.

Mohd Abdullah said:
infinite Universe (that's it, if an imaginary object keep moving straight forever it will never return to its starting point) is more likely than the finite yet unbounded Universe.

This is true, but not for the reason you give. It's true because the model in which the universe is spatially infinite (and spatially flat) is the best fit to the data we have.

The rest of your post is personal speculation.
 
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  • #33
This topic has been sufficiently discussed. Thread closed.
 

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