What Secrets Do Titan's Dunes Hold for Dune-boarding Enthusiasts?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the features of Titan, Saturn's moon, particularly its dunes and the implications for potential resources like methane. Participants explore the nature of Titan's surface materials, the formation of methane, and the challenges of utilizing resources on Titan.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Technical explanation

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants note that Titan's dunes may be composed of ice crystals or other unknown materials, rather than silicate sand.
  • There is a discussion about the presence of methane on Titan, with some questioning whether it requires organic material for its formation.
  • One participant suggests that Titan's cold environment makes it impractical to utilize its resources in the foreseeable future.
  • Another participant mentions that methane and ethane can form through non-biological processes, indicating that their presence on Titan does not necessarily imply past biological activity.
  • Concerns are raised about the feasibility of using Titan's resources, with some suggesting that it is too cold for human intervention.
  • Participants express appreciation for the images returned from the Huygens mission, discussing the quality and resolution of the visuals.
  • There is a mention of the differences between actual images and animations in the Huygens descent video, with a preference for raw images over processed ones.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express a range of views on the nature of Titan's resources and the implications of methane's presence, indicating that multiple competing views remain. The discussion does not reach a consensus on the necessity of organic material for methane formation or the practicality of utilizing Titan's resources.

Contextual Notes

Some statements depend on assumptions about the formation of methane and the conditions on Titan, which remain unresolved. The discussion also reflects varying interpretations of the Huygens mission's imagery.

quantumcarl
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Dune-boarding anyone?!

Saturn's moon Titan has dunes [Friday, May 5, 2006 Posted: 1611 GMT (0011 HKT)]


WASHINGTON (Reuters) -- Saturn's moon Titan has huge regions covered with dunes, possibly made out of ice crystals, sand or some other unknown material, international space scientists reported on Thursday.

http://edition.cnn.com/2006/TECH/space/05/05/titan.dunes.reut/index.html
 
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Astronomy news on Phys.org
Looky here!

Titan Posters and images of Titan's surface

http://www.lpl.arizona.edu/DISR/Multimedia/Description%20of%20Titan%20Posters.htm

More details on Huygens - http://www.lpl.arizona.edu/DISR/

and more goodies at NASA/JPL

http://saturn.jpl.nasa.gov/news/press-release-details.cfm?newsID=655
 
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Whats really neat is that its water sand not silicate sand. Thats the really cool part.
 
Astronuc said:
Looky here!

Titan Posters and images of Titan's surface

http://www.lpl.arizona.edu/DISR/Multimedia/Description%20of%20Titan%20Posters.htm

More details on Huygens - http://www.lpl.arizona.edu/DISR/

and more goodies at NASA/JPL

http://saturn.jpl.nasa.gov/news/press-release-details.cfm?newsID=655

Thanks for these links Astronuc.
All I can say is thank you Nasa and Partners. Its lucky for us they enjoy the scads of work they do to bring us these images and info!
 
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I could ask about a billion questions though.

Does methane occur without there first being organic material? Or, was Titan covered in plant life or sea life at one time, hence, today, we find methane there?

Looking at all the methane on Titan from a fuel challenged planet is like being a kid on the outside of a candy shop window. Except the glass in the window is several million miles thick.
 
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quantumcarl said:
I could ask about a billion questions though.

Does methane occur without there first being organic material? Or, was Titan covered in plant life or sea life at one time, hence, today, we find methane there?

Looking at all the methane on Titan from a fuel challenged planet is like being a kid on the outside of a candy shop window. Except the glass in the window is several million miles thick.


Its far too cold on titan for us to actually be able to do anything with the resources there in the forseeable future. It'll be far too late.

Methane is just one carbon and four hydrogens, there is no reason it has to be formed biologically. The same is true of ethane, and so on. Just because we see it formed biologically here doesn't mean anything for its formation elsewhere.
 
franznietzsche said:
Its far too cold on titan for us to actually be able to do anything with the resources there in the forseeable future. It'll be far too late.

Methane is just one carbon and four hydrogens, there is no reason it has to be formed biologically. The same is true of ethane, and so on. Just because we see it formed biologically here doesn't mean anything for its formation elsewhere.

Yes, thank you! I looked that up. Some call this a primary atmosphere. Somewhat on the way to becoming a secondary atmosphere suchas ours. But, if what you say is true and its too cold there for much other than "ice sand"... or to use as a resource, then, at least its a pretty moon.:wink:
 
The images of view of the landing was simply awesome. I actually downloaded the 156 megabyte version while I was reading the news sites. The resolution was simply phenomenal. You really have to hand it to the folks that design, build, launch and maintain these programs. The images they return are really cool. :)
 
quantumcarl said:
Yes, thank you! I looked that up. Some call this a primary atmosphere. Somewhat on the way to becoming a secondary atmosphere suchas ours. But, if what you say is true and its too cold there for much other than "ice sand"... or to use as a resource, then, at least its a pretty moon.:wink:


Its not too cold to use, its too cold for us to be able to go down there and get it. At least for the forseeable future.
 
  • #10
franznietzsche said:
Its not too cold to use, its too cold for us to be able to go down there and get it. At least for the forseeable future.

Yeah, I guess we'll just have to grow enough corn etc... and produce our own methane.

There's a plan afoot to heat communities with their own sewage pipes. The heat generated in those things is enough to heat the community using the pipes. Now, we could also put a dome over each of the cattle stockyards and capture enough methane to get to Titan... holding our noses.
 
  • #11
quantumcarl said:
Yeah, I guess we'll just have to grow enough corn etc...

I don't want to get into this in this forum but corn-based ethanol is a bad idea, probably worse than gasoline, unless we suddenly shut down all coal power plants in favor of other sources.
 
  • #12
franznietzsche said:
I don't want to get into this in this forum but corn-based ethanol is a bad idea, probably worse than gasoline, unless we suddenly shut down all coal power plants in favor of other sources.

I'd like to know what percentage of the images sent home from Huygens were used in the video of the descent and what percent was animation.

You can sort of see the differences in texture between the actual images and the animation of the landscape as Huygens approaches but there are re-buffering moments and what appear to be sand storms or just camera movement so, it gets unclear what is totally off of Huygens and what is totally out of a NASA contract animator. I prefer the raw images in stills to any messin' around even if they are thermal or radar generated.
 
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