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Where are Pilot Waves located?

  1. Jul 18, 2011 #1
    Are Bohmian pilot waves located inside spacetime? Or is it independent of the Lorenztian metric? What are the constraints or possibilities? What is the pilot wave connection to the vacuum. We have heard such a thing as false vacuum. Could pilot waves be located in a false vacuum? If this false vacuum separates itself from our vacuum... could pilot waves located in the false vacuum be composed of magnetic monopoles? Or are pilot waves completely substanceless? What are the mainstream belief and theoretical possibilities that make it consistent with the predictions of quantum mechanics?
  2. jcsd
  3. Jul 20, 2011 #2
    I think Bohmians are still Copenhagenist in "essence" in that the vacuum were being conceptualized in a Copenhagen sense. This is in contrast to pure Bohmians. I'll explain. Remember Dirac when he proposed about negative sea of electrons in the vacuum? This structure in the vacuum is in contrast to pure mathematical formulation which is what I meant having a Copenhagen "essence".

    Now is it possible to conceptualize the pilot wave purely without any Copenhagen flavoring? Yes. One can treat the pilot wave as being in another sector of vacuum separated from the vacuum of matter. A solid state physicist Dr. William Tiller (who wrote the book "The Science of Crystallization: Macroscopic Phenomena and Defect Generation" https://www.amazon.com/Science-Crys...8287/ref=sr_1_9?ie=UTF8&qid=1311207579&sr=8-9) actually proposed that this separate vacuum where pilot waves were located have counterpart of our electromagnetic field, he called it magnetoelectric field where as counterpart of our matter electric charge, it has magnetic monopoles in that vacuum domain. This produce a perfect symmetry where electric charge in our matter world has its counterpart of magnetic charge (monopoles) in the pilot wave world (or vacuum). Now is there any solid arguments or theoretical reasoning why this proposal is not possible? Dr. Tiller expanded the theory to include many things but let me just focus on this main claim above because it is the meat of it. If it is refuted.. then everything falls down like domino so let's avoid his other stuff. If if you know this pilot wave in separate vacuum theory is false, then please share why so.. attack the theory.. not the personality.
  4. Jul 21, 2011 #3
    Very intriguing riezer. Can you point out an example of a result Tiller derives which explains effects that are not understood otherwise?

    Drawing back to a Maxwellian viewpoint, EM fields are propagated because there is tension or pressure (positive or negative) of some type lying underneath the vacuum. It isn't required that that tension has only a single component or only one manifestation, especially if we are considering weak and strong forces in addition to EM.
  5. Jul 21, 2011 #4

    I don't know. But let's just focus on the basic idea and whether it can be refuted. The idea or symmetry that

    Particle world = Electromagnetic force composing of electric monopoles
    Wave (pilot wave) world = Magnetoelectric force composing of magnetic monopoles

    Each of them in its own vacuum region.

    Remember de Broglie when he boldly proposed that not only is photon wave-like but all matter. Before him, no one even thought about it. So could we have similar Nobel calibre thing in this this idea of magnetic monopoles populating the pilot wave vacuum world or region? Ok. Someone expert in vacuum physics or even Bohmians, please refute this by outright theoretical counterargument so we won't think about it or be bothered about it again. Thanks.
  6. Jul 21, 2011 #5


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    Staff: Mentor

    Physics Forums is not in the business of refuting or discussing ideas that have not already been put forth in a peer-reviewed scientific journal. Please click the "Rules" link the top of any page here and note the section Overly Speculative Posts.

    I can find no indication that Tiller has published his ideas in a peer-reviewed journal, only on his own Web site and possibly in non-academic (vanity press?) publications.
    Last edited: Jul 21, 2011
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