Why do Black Holes evaporate due to Hawking radiation?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the mechanism of black hole evaporation due to Hawking radiation, specifically focusing on the role of virtual particle-antiparticle pairs near the event horizon. Participants explore the implications of particle capture and energy loss in relation to mass changes in black holes, delving into both conceptual and technical aspects of quantum mechanics.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants describe the process where virtual particle-antiparticle pairs are created near a black hole, with one particle being captured and the other escaping, leading to mass loss for the black hole.
  • Questions arise regarding how the capture of a 'normal' virtual particle affects the mass of the black hole, with some suggesting it could lead to an increase in mass instead.
  • A participant asserts that the description of virtual particles is an analogy, indicating that it may not accurately represent the underlying physics.
  • Another participant notes that emitted particles carry away energy, which is equivalent to mass, suggesting that this is how the black hole appears to lose mass.
  • One contribution mentions that virtual particles can have negative energy with respect to spatial infinity, which is proposed as a reason for the mass loss of the black hole.
  • A description of the black hole's boundary as "fuzzy" is introduced, suggesting that the virtual pair scenario occurs in this uncertain region.
  • Another participant emphasizes the importance of the uncertainty principle in understanding the behavior of virtual particles and their impact on black hole mass.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express various interpretations of the Hawking radiation process, with no consensus reached on the specifics of how mass loss occurs or the validity of the virtual particle analogy. Multiple competing views remain regarding the mechanics of particle interactions and energy considerations.

Contextual Notes

Limitations include the reliance on analogies that may not fully capture the complexities of quantum mechanics and the uncertainty principle, as well as unresolved questions about the nature of energy and mass in this context.

lightoflife
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A book I read says that when virtual particle-antiparticle pairs are created near a black hole then sometimes one of the particle pairs will be captured by the black hole while the other one will be freed to move away as a real particle - then this causes the black hole to lose mass and thus evaporate.

How does it cause the black hole to lose mass if the particle captured by the black hole is a 'normal' virtual particle instead of the antiparticle of the pair?

I would think that the virtual antiparticle -once captured- might interact with all the normal matter inside the black hole to somehow reduce mass.

But if the captured virtual particle is a 'normal' or in other words not a virtual antiparticle then should not this cause the mass of the black hole to increase?
 
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lightoflife said:
A book I read says that when virtual particle-antiparticle pairs are created near a black hole then sometimes one of the particle pairs will be captured by the black hole while the other one will be freed to move away as a real particle - then this causes the black hole to lose mass and thus evaporate.

How does it cause the black hole to lose mass if the particle captured by the black hole is a 'normal' virtual particle instead of the antiparticle of the pair?

I would think that the virtual antiparticle -once captured- might interact with all the normal matter inside the black hole to somehow reduce mass.

But if the captured virtual particle is a 'normal' or in other words not a virtual antiparticle then should not this cause the mass of the black hole to increase?
This whole "virtual particle pair" thing is NOT what actually happens. That was a description given by Hawking for the advanced-math-challenged folks (most of us) who only speak English, as it was the best he could do to translate the math into something that roughly made sense in English. It is a flawed analogy and needs to just be accepted AS an analogy.
 
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As I understand it the emitted particles also carry away energy. Since energy is equivalent to mass then from the outside it must look like the BH is loosing mass.

If I've got that wrong or it's also only an analogy perhaps someone could let me know! I'm not an expert on QM by any means.
 
CWatters said:
As I understand it the emitted particles also carry away energy. Since energy is equivalent to mass then from the outside it must look like the BH is loosing mass.

If I've got that wrong or it's also only an analogy perhaps someone could let me know! I'm not an expert on QM by any means.
The whole IDEA of it being cause by particle pairs is, according to Hawking, just an analogy so it doesn't matter if you are talking about mass or energy or both.

I wish I understood the math so I could try to explain where the analogy goes wrong, but if Hawking can't do it I figure I wouldn't have much chance :smile:
 
Virtual particles can have negative energy with respect to spatial infinity, hence why the black hole loses mass. As an aside, antiparticles don't have negative mass, which seems to be part of your misconception about the mechanism behind the radiation.
 
One description I saw (can't give a reference) describes the boundary of a black hole as fuzzy, so the virtual pair scenario can be though of as taking place in this fuzzy zone.
 
lightoflife said:
A book I read says that when virtual particle-antiparticle pairs are created near a black hole then sometimes one of the particle pairs will be captured by the black hole while the other one will be freed to move away as a real particle - then this causes the black hole to lose mass and thus evaporate.

How does it cause the black hole to lose mass if the particle captured by the black hole is a 'normal' virtual particle instead of the antiparticle of the pair?

I would think that the virtual antiparticle -once captured- might interact with all the normal matter inside the black hole to somehow reduce mass.

But if the captured virtual particle is a 'normal' or in other words not a virtual antiparticle then should not this cause the mass of the black hole to increase?

In an abstract sense, the key word here isn't anti-matter/particle, it's virtual particle. In accordance with the uncertainty principle, virtual particle pairs can only exist for a certain amount of time before they mutually annihilate (in accordance with the first law of thermodynamics)-

\Delta E \Delta t=\frac{\hbar}{2}

regardless of which particle is taken into the BH, the other particle will become real, if it is the antimatter particle, then it will most likely almost instantly interact with regular matter and annihilate into photons, if the regular particle escapes, then it will simply interact with regular matter. Due to the first law of thermodynamics, the particle that falls into the BH, regardless of whether it is the anti-particle or the regular particle, will become negative (which is a mechanism not fully understood but is result of the uncertainty principle and first law) and as a result, the BH loses mass.

Below is a link to an old article on the subject-

'The Quantum Mechanics of Black Holes' by Stephen Hawking
http://www.phys.uwosh.edu/rioux/thermo/pdf/Black Holes -- Hawking.pdf
 

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