Why do couplings run with log of energy?

  • Context: Graduate 
  • Thread starter Thread starter franoisbelfor
  • Start date Start date
  • Tags Tags
    Energy Log
Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion centers on why coupling constants in quantum field theories run with the logarithm of energy, exploring the implications of renormalization and the mathematical foundations behind this behavior. Participants seek to understand the reasons for the logarithmic dependence and whether alternative functions could describe this phenomenon.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • François states that coupling constants run with the logarithm of energy due to renormalization and questions why this specific function is used.
  • Some participants mention that the logarithmic behavior arises from calculations involving loop integrals in renormalization, suggesting that logarithms are "slow functions."
  • François reiterates the desire for a simpler explanation of why logarithms are preferred over other functions.
  • One participant emphasizes that the logarithm's presence is a mathematical consequence, but does not provide clarity on its significance.
  • Another participant explains that while logarithmic behavior is common, it is not universal; coupling constants can run in different ways depending on the theory's construction.
  • Discussion includes the concept of scaling and the introduction of an energy scale during renormalization, with the logarithm being a useful mathematical tool for maintaining dimensionless ratios.
  • It is noted that in some theories, such as certain supersymmetric QCD models, coupling constants can run according to power laws rather than logarithmic functions.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the universality of logarithmic running of coupling constants, with some asserting that it is a common feature in the Standard Model while others highlight that alternative behaviors exist in different theories. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the reasons for the specific choice of logarithmic dependence.

Contextual Notes

Participants mention that the behavior of coupling constants can vary based on the construction of the Lagrangian and that the logarithmic dependence is often chosen for its mathematical properties, but do not resolve the implications of these choices.

franoisbelfor
Messages
42
Reaction score
0
Coupling constants run with the logarithm of energy.
This is a result of renormalization, its equations, and the
change of the effect of the virtual particle cloud with energy.

Is there a simple way to understand why this happens with the
log of energy, instead of with another function?

Logarithm is the integral of 1 over r; does this enter somehow?

François
 
Physics news on Phys.org
It comes from "the equations of renormalization", you calculate a lot of loop integrals which gives you Log's

And that is why in fact you "can do" renormalization, the log's are "slow functions"
 
malawi_glenn said:
It comes from "the equations of renormalization", you calculate a lot of loop integrals which gives you Log's

And that is why in fact you "can do" renormalization, the log's are "slow functions"

Well, I know that, as I wrote in my post. But why log? Why not something else?
Can one explain this in simple terms?

François
 
why is not this "simple"??

The log just comes from math.
 
franoisbelfor said:
Logarithm is the integral of 1 over r; does this enter somehow?

Yes, but that by itself doesn't really tell you anything. You can always take an equation with a logarithm in it and express it as a differential equation with a 1/x in it instead. That DE may or may not provide additional insight.

As Malawi_Glenn points out, the key is that the coupling constant varies slowly. If the coupling constant varied quickly, we wouldn't call it a constant and wouldn't use the mathematical machinery that we do to describe it. We'd pick something else.
 
In fact, it is the other way round:

You know for sure, that the theories we construct suffer from being well-behaved either at low or high energy limits. As a consequence, many of the integrals are divergent (either IR or UV).

To get a proper meaningful theory out of these divergent quantities (a theory which learns to live with the problems and still remains meaningful), one redefines the physical quantities, what is called re-normalization. And hence the coupling constants, for example, run (with energy).

Now, it is not that the quantities always run as log of energy... depending upon how you constructed your Lagrangian they can run more violently ... but, we select ONLY those theories which show a log dependence behavior: the logarithmic function is the slowest changing function and confirms the least sensitivity of your theory to the cut off energy (value of which you are not generally aware)

So, in short, it is not that the couplings run always logarithmically with energy, but it is your choice which decides the dependence and we (generally) chose theories which are renormalizable (and hence showing a log dependence)
 
Expanding somewhat on what njoshi3 said:

The reason has to do with the phenomenon of "scaling." When you renormalize a coupling you are forced to introduce an energy scale (this is standard renormalization theory - see your favorite textbook), called the "subtraction scale" (M). Then by ordinary dimensional analysis, without any other energy scales in the problem (let's imagine that all the masses are zero for the moment) all dimensionless functions can only depend on the dimensionless scale E/M, where E is the energy, since this is the only dimensionless quantity left! Adding masses or dimensionful couplings means that there are more ratios you can construct, but that's fine.

It is an old trick that whenever you have a dimensionless ratio that can cover the entire positive real line, it is often very useful to take the log of that ratio, which maintains the dimensionless-ness of the ratio and is bijective, so it has an entire inverse (the exponential function). Find me another function that does this.

But it is NOT necessarily true that operators only run logarithmically with energy. They could run as a power law as well.

For example, QCD with a vanishing beta function runs power law, not logarithmically. This happens, for example, in supersymmetric QCD with Dirac gluinos (something I've been researching recently!). So the running can be more general, it's just that in the Standard Model, all the Lagrangian parameters have logarithmic running. But that's not true in the most general case.
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
1K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
3K
  • · Replies 9 ·
Replies
9
Views
4K
  • · Replies 15 ·
Replies
15
Views
4K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
7K
  • · Replies 13 ·
Replies
13
Views
4K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
2K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
2K