Why is an AK-47 being offered as a promotion for buying a truck in Missouri?

[turbo]

I got a case, loader, 4 12-rd mags, molded double-mag pouch, underarm holster, 25 rds ball-nose FMJ and a nearly full box of 50 Federal Hydra-Shock. Used, but barely. $475

I think I did alright.

You did OK. I am a thief.

 

[negitron]

I think the laws of physics alone justify the statement that there is an optimum configuration for accuracy.

Not really, at least in practice. Accuracy is a fairly variable metric, because even subtle manufacturing differences in the weapon, variances in propellant composition, bullet construction and mass distribution and environmental factors, among others, can cause even otherwise identical weapons with identical loads to bench test significantly differently. You can probably find an optimum load/projectile combination for a given weapon, but for every one of those, you can likely find an optimum but different load/projectile combo for an entirely different caliber with equal performance.

 

[turbo]

I think the laws of physics alone justify the statement that there is an optimum configuration for accuracy. For example, smaller bullets mean less wind resistance and therefore less turbulance given the optimum shape. A bolt action [a single-shot was actually specified] ensures that the chamber is as vibration-free as possible. But I will have to a little digging to find a source. It was stated as a fact wrt world-class competitive shooting.

I don't know how much you'll have to dig. I talked to an officer at a local shooting club about joining and competing. I had a wonderful Stevens rifle with a Pope barrel and wanted to punch paper. When I asked about competitions, the guy told me that I could not enter any contests with a .22. When I asked why, he said that anybody could drop in with a Winchester M52 and wipe up. Of course, he didn't know that I had that pin-point Stevens at the time, but the point was made. .22s are really accurate at short ranges, or even at longer ranges if wind is not a factor.

 

[drankin]

BTW, for those not already bored to tears about ballistics, etc, why did the US military embrace the .308, when the .30-06 had performed most admirably for decades?

The reason was that you could get more rounds through an automatic weapon in a set amount of time because the .308 casing is significantly shorter than a .30-06 casing, enabling much shorter bolt-throw and faster cycling. The .30-06 is still revered as a "sniper" round, especially in Springfield bolt-actions with star-gauged barrels.

I believe they adopted the .308 because it is basically the 7.62x51mm NATO bullet common ammo of our allies. The 30-06 used in WWII is a great round but heavier. They wanted the lightest ammo that could get the job done.

I'll take a discount on a car purchase instead of one of those hideous rifles.

 

[turbo]

I believe they adopted the .308 because it is basically the 7.62x51mm NATO bullet common ammo of our allies. The 30-06 used in WWII is a great round but heavier. They wanted the lightest ammo that could get the job done.

I'll take a discount on a car purchase instead of one of those hideous rifles.

That may be a bit backward. Remember that when the Allies took Europe back from nationalistic Germany the US had already glommed onto .30 cal rounds, such as the .30-06, the .30 carbine and others. One of my favorite Nazi-proofed bolt-actions was a Mauser 8mm. Heavy, but a nice gun.

 

[negitron]

http://hunting.about.com/od/guns/l/aasttopriflecar.htm

The 6mm PPC is anything but cheap to shoot; last time I looked, cases were selling at 75 cents each, and they still had to be fine-tuned before being used. Even though Americans Lou Palmisano and Ferris Pindell created the little cartridge, it is foreign to most American shooters. On top of all that, while the 6mm PPC has been around for over 20 years not a single American ammo manufacturer has chosen to load it. What the 6mm PPC has done and continues to do is break more world accuracy records in registered benchrest shooting than any other cartridge, and it shows no sign of slowing down. When firearms correspondents of the future write about such things, the 6mm PPC will be mentioned most often as the accuracy cartridge of the 20th century.

 

[junglebeast]

For reference, I hunt big game with up-loaded .45-70s in a Ruger Model 1 single-shot. I have never shot a deer that took more than one or two steps (momentum, mostly).

What does that have to do with the .223?

I would never hunt anything other than paper with a .223. It does not have the stopping power that I require to humanely kill an animal.

It sounds like you are concluding from the small diameter of hole that it puts in a piece of paper, that it will also put a small hole into an animal. For the reasons I have explained above, you are flat wrong. Perhaps you are mistaking the .223 = 5.56x45mm with the 22 LR or 22 short, or some older variant of the 223.

The fact is that the 5.56 which you referred to as weak has far better stopping power than your .45-70 within 500m range.

The 5.56 is not acceptable as a hunting round, especially not for big game, for several reasons. Primarily, you may want longer range and better wind resistance...and the 5.56 loses its accuracy and stopping power at longer ranges because it loses its frangibility below about 1700 fps. At ranges where it is still frangible, it is still not acceptable as a hunting round because nobody wants shrapnel in their carcass, nobody wants the back side of the pelt to have a gaping hole in it. This is considered inhumane among other things.

The reason that the military standardized on the .223 is that troops could carry a LOT more rounds in the field than the heavier .308, partly on the "spray and pray" philosophy, AND the little guns were lots lighter. As you may know, troops in Viet Nam who had a choice (often point-men on patrol, like my cousin who got tapped for two tours on point) often opted for the BAR instead of the light .223s. Our European allies continue to use .308s (7.62) in the FN, H&K, etc.

When looking at wound profiles it is important to note that the outer line represents the shock wave, and does not cause permanent damage or rupturing. The actual damage caused can be well approximated by integrating the volume of the actual wound cavity. Looking at the 22 LR, you can see it does nothing other than bore a pinprick hole:

http://www.firearmstactical.com/images/Wound%20Profiles/22LR%2037gr%20HP%20Wound%20Profile.jpg

The 7.62mm NATO round is slightly better, due to its slightly larger caliber and rotation..but still it is only immediately deadly if the CNS is hit. Otherwise it is just a bleed wound,

http://www.geocities.com/whiskey99a/image008.gif

Contrast this to the .223,

http://www.firearmstactical.com/images/Wound%20Profiles/M855.jpg

 

[Huckleberry]

It was interesting to note that in one of the countries with the lowest violent crime rates, Switzerland, people have "machine guns" [fully automatic weapons] in their homes. Is it any wonder that the crime rate is low?

That's a terrible weapon for self-defense! "That's not a gun. This is a gun." More importantly to me is that they are all trained to use them and not to fear them.

As you may know, troops in Viet Nam who had a choice (often point-men on patrol, like my cousin who got tapped for two tours on point) often opted for the BAR instead of the light .223s. Our European allies continue to use .308s (7.62) in the FN, H&K, etc.

My uncle who served 2 tours in forced recon preferred the M14 over the M16. He said the reliability was better. He also said he liked to keep a LAW rocket. Now that would make for some interesting home defense.