Why there's No Unified Theory ?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the challenges of unifying quantum electrodynamics (QED) with gravity and other fundamental forces. Participants explore theoretical, conceptual, and historical aspects of this problem, including the nature of forces, scales of interaction, and the implications of energy levels in the early universe.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Exploratory

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants suggest that the fundamental difference in the strength of gravity compared to other forces complicates unification, particularly at atomic and subatomic scales.
  • One participant notes that gravity is described by differential geometry rather than quantum methods, highlighting a methodological incompatibility.
  • There is mention of theories like string theory and quantum loops that attempt to unify gravity with other forces, but no definitive proof exists yet.
  • Another viewpoint expresses skepticism about the current understanding, suggesting that a lack of intelligence or insight has hindered progress in unification.
  • Participants discuss the relationship between energy levels and the unification of forces, particularly in the context of the early universe when only energy existed.
  • One participant raises the question of how a theory could explain matter behavior at extremely high energy levels, such as those present shortly after the Big Bang.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express a range of views on the reasons for the lack of unification, with some emphasizing methodological differences and others suggesting a need for further understanding. There is no consensus on a singular reason or solution to the problem.

Contextual Notes

Participants acknowledge the limitations of current theories and the challenges posed by the scales of energy and interaction involved in unifying the forces.

Arman777
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What's the main reason that we cannot unify QED and Gravity or with other foces ?
 
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@Arman777 , our current unified fiel theory comprises electromagnetism, the week nuclear force and the strong nuclear force. The problem of gravity is, first...its order of strength is much smaller than the other ones. That means that, on atomic and subatomic scales (where the other forces may compete, interact and compose), gravity seems to have no part due to the small masses involved. Einstein theorized that gravity could be the reason why the different "repelling parts" of an electron are held together, but that electrons even have parts, we haven't be able to demonstrate. At the same time, the best description of gravity doesn't use quantum methods, where we suppose the natural forces as virtual particles and whose interaction can be worked out by Feynman diagrams. Gravity is described by differential geometry, and effects on the topology of space time. So, it's both the incompatibility in scales of action and in methods of explanation. We do believe that, as we increase on the scales of energy, we may see gravity merge with the other forces. There are some theories who try to make that to work out, like string theory or quantum loops. But so far, nothing could be definitely proved.
 
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Arman777 said:
What's the main reason that we cannot unify QED and Gravity or with other foces ?
Because no one has been smart enough to be able to do it yet.
 
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jtbell said:
Because no one has been smart enough to be able to do it yet.
Thats an another point of view.

Maybe we need to learn more so we can unify them

Interestingly, the idea of constant speed of light is the basis of SR and hence GR while light is about electromagnetism so it seems awkward..In Newtonian view we can't talk about the speed of light but only masses and forces and etc.as Luka said..I remember a diagram that we need a lot of GeV to unify them or it was something like.

Here it's
smbrk.gif


How is energy related to unifying them ?

As in the beginning of the universe like ##10^-39## second or less there was only energy and nothing else and the universe was really small..Its really hard to believe that a theory will explain how matter behaves in that era.
 

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