Wormholes & Warp Drives: Can Circular Polarizers Create Them?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the question of whether circular polarizers can generate wormholes and warp drives. Participants explore the relationship between optical phenomena, such as circular polarization and singularities, and their potential connections to concepts in general relativity, including black holes and spacetime structures.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • One participant inquires if circular polarizers can generate wormholes and warp drives.
  • Another participant questions the relevance of circular polarization to wormholes and warp drives.
  • Some participants suggest that polarization singularities may relate to phase singularities and black holes.
  • There is a discussion about the mathematical distinctions between optical singularities and gravitational singularities, with one participant emphasizing that the issues arise in the math rather than the physics.
  • References are provided to support claims regarding optical phenomena and their theoretical implications.
  • One participant notes a mathematical analogy between transformation optics and general relativity, mentioning a speaker who has contributed to this field.
  • Another participant asserts that optical black holes are not the same as gravitational black holes, clarifying that they simulate gravitational effects without being true singularities.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express disagreement regarding the relationship between optical and gravitational singularities. Some assert that they are fundamentally different, while others explore potential connections without reaching a consensus.

Contextual Notes

The discussion highlights limitations in understanding the definitions and implications of singularities in different contexts, as well as the need for clarity in distinguishing between optical and gravitational phenomena.

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TL;DR
circular polarizers wormholes warp drives
hello i would like to ask if circular polarizers generate wormholes and warp drives. thanks very much.
 
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sddfds said:
Summary: circular polarizers wormholes warp drives

hello i would like to ask if circular polarizers generate wormholes and warp drives. thanks very much.
HUH? Are you talking about THIS: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Circular_polarization ?
What would that have to do with wormholes and warp drives?
 
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phinds said:
HUH? Are you talking about THIS: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Circular_polarization ?
What would that have to do with wormholes and warp drives?
yes, circular polarization. polarization singularities are the superposition of phase singularities which are black holes. thanks.
 
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sddfds said:
yes, circular polarization. polarization singularities are the superposition of phase singularities which are black holes. thanks.
I think you need to supply a reference to support this claim.
 
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sddfds said:
yes, circular polarization. polarization singularities are the superposition of phase singularities which are black holes. thanks.
The word “singularity” is used to describe points where an otherwise well-behaved mathematical formula doesn’t apply; the most easily understood example might be Coulomb’s Law ##F=q_1q_2/r^2## which works everywhere except where ##r=0##. It is important to understand that the problem here is in the math, not the physics.

A polarization singularly is a point where the standard polarization equation doesn’t work, so has nothing to do with the gravitational singularity where the equations of general relativity don’t work.
 
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As @Nugatory notes, you seem to have confused the singularities in the mathematics of optics with the singularities in the mathematics of spacetime, some of which are inside black holes. They are not the same thing.
 
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ok thanks a lot.
 
sddfds said:
i would like to ask if circular polarizers generate wormholes and warp drives
No, they don't. First, as others have posted, the "singularities" that appear in the references you give on polarizers are not the same as the singularities that appear in GR at the centers of black holes. Second, even leaving that aside, wormholes and warp drives are not black holes and do not have spacetime singularities in them.
 
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  • #10
are optical black holes the same as gravitational black holes. thanks.
 
  • #11
there's a close mathematical analogy between a sub-field of optics called transformation optics and general relativity. if you have a light ray with some sort of bendy trajectory, you can 'undo' the bendiness by doing a coordinate transformation and use the same transformation to calculate the refractive index n(r) you'd need to give the bendy trajectory in the first place.

went to see John Pendry speak about his work on this subject (specifically, metamaterials) a while back - he is considered to be in the running for a nobel prize at some point!
 
  • #12
sddfds said:
are optical black holes the same as gravitational black holes.
No.
 
  • #13
sddfds said:
"Optical black holes are not true singularities. They use optical effects to simulate gravitational black holes, which are singularities. The distinction is important." Right from your sources. So the answer is simply NO.
 

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