Another magnetic fuel economy enhancer?

[sophiecentaur]

http://www.fueltec.no/"
I don't know whether this is the right place to post but I have come across the above website. It seems to be another of these magnetic treatments for improving fuel efficiency. Does anyone have an opinion as to whether it's a goer or just a way of chucking money away?
I have experience of a magnetic limescale inhibitor which seems to have an effect but Carbon Chemistry would be different, wouldn't it?

 

[Gordianus]

The magnetic permeability of any fuel is very close to that of vacuum (unless someone added a ferromagnetic material). Thus magnets have no influence on fuels. The claim is simply snake oil

 

[Subductionzon]

And how does a magnetic lime scale inhibitor work? That is more snake oil.

Replacing rock salt may be a pain, but unless you have a reverse osmosis filter the only way to soften water is with an ion exchanger.

 

[davenn]

my gosh!

how can people get away with this crap hahaha

Truck Fuel Catalyser
The Fuel Catalyser is manufactured from a thermo plastic material, polycarbonate. The catalyser is a new scientific development, and is unique as it generates electro magnetic radiation to the fuel molecules without any use of external energy

hmmm ... must be a very interesting polycarbonate to be able to produce a magnetic field without the presence of any iron or other rare Earth metals normally assoc with magnets

far out! the mind really boggles

Dave

 

[sophiecentaur]

No idea how it works. But the inhibitors are not softeners. Limescale is physically different from place to place. It can form hard layers or softer, powdery coating, even in the same supply area. Viacal seems to work differently in different neighbourhoods, for instance. I have used an electric inhibitor for several years and it has altered the nature of the scale so that it can now be wiped off. So there's no point in just asserting that you can't soften water with a magnet. That is not what is claimed.
I was after a more reasoned response than to be told that something just can't work because it seems to violate School Science.

 

[Subductionzon]

The problem with hard water deposits is that they are very slow in occurring. If you are wiping off the scale more frequently it is possible that you are getting to it before it can set.

The makers of these miracle water softeners are the ones making extraordinary claims, it is up to them to offer extraordinary evidence. As to damage inside of pipes or in a water heater, it can take years for the calcium to build up. Since you have already spent your money it is too late for you, but if I was looking for a water softener I would want a lot more evidence besides some quasi scientific claims about magnetizing ions that can't be magnetized before I bought one.

 

[sophiecentaur]

I have tried to factor out subjective effects. The electric kettle is a fairly objective object, though. Scale now forms differently and is constantly cracking and being shed. Now it just sloshes around in the bottom instead of forming a strong structure. I have read of supporting experimental evidence which didn't contain the hokum that is present in the fuel economy link.

 

[sophiecentaur]

Also, I didn't buy the inhibitor on the strength of any "pseudo-scientific claims". I bought it because many local plumbers find them effective (oh yes, they make a profit out of selling them but so does every manufacturer and supplier of every product) and because a technician friend of mine did some tests, in a UK University lab, using kettles and a range of products and found that there was a positive result. aamof, there is actually advice against their use by one small bore solar heating company on the grounds that a powdery deposit clogs the system!

I think the objections, so far are not well founded. First of all, the devices don't claim to be water softeners and secondly, the objections are based on 'principle' and elementary ideas like "magnetisation". These forums are full of people making arguments and giving explanations of various quantum effects which are based on the basic Hydrogen model. Clearly that's not an appropriate model for explaining any solid state phenomenon, for example - yet they still do it. I have a feeling that the objections about these scale inhibitors are a bit along those lines - rejection on the grounds of a too-simple model. Crystal growth is very subtle and I wonder how many contributors here actually know much about it and how energy levels can effect it.
Google reveals a lot of papers on the subject of scale inhibitors (many of them are Chinese) - too hard work for me to look at much of the stuff but this link
http://en.cnki.com.cn/Article_en/CJFDTOTAL-SCLJ200601015.htm"
is an example. Before rejecting the idea on the grounds that it doesn't 'sound right' people could see what a simple google search yields.

I cannot find an equivalent volume of information confirming the 'fuel improvement' claims. This is why I raised the question. The differences between the way ions and organic molecules behave are very marked so it wouldn't surprise me if the fuel claim is nonsense, despite the apparent sucess with scale inhibitors - but it would be nice to read a bit more than a "snake oil" comment and the simple word "magnetisation" in any skeptical posts. Would one use the term 'magnetisation of ions' when describing how a mass spectrometer works, for instance?
I have to admit that I am a fierce 'knocker' of most ideas of this kind, myself so I know where you're coming from.

 

[Gordianus]

I'm no expert in water softeners but I know there are electric ions. Thus, I may consider some sort of electric field may lessen the growth of layers. However, I still contend the magnetic effects are close to nil.

 

[sophiecentaur]

But we're not discussing water softeners at all.
Are you saying that ions are not affected as they move through a magnetic field?

 

[Naty1]

Supposedly passing large hydrocarbon molecules thru a magnetic field breaks up the molecules and aids combustion. Another one of these products is ALGAE-X although it has nothing to do with algae, it supposedly keeps filters cleaner.

From people who have used them on recreational boats, some think they have cleaner exhausts...less soot on sterns...and maybe less filter clogging, but of course you never know from one fill up to the next what you are really getting.

Claims of 15% fuel savings seem WAY out of line. If that were true, every truck and bus fleet operator, for example, would have them installed.

 

[sophiecentaur]

If there were much in this, Ford and the rest would have surely taken it up and used it. They are all desperate to be seen as economical as possible and to increase their market share.

What sort of field are you suggesting that may be needed to "break up the molecules"? Are not the Octanes etc. needed to moderate the rate of burning of petrol - and allow high compression ratios?

 

[Gordianus]

Fuel molecules don't break up under the influence of a magnetic field. I've seen this claim many times; it's periodicity depends on how fast people forget it's a scam.