The Seven Warning Signs of Voodoo Science

[ZapperZ]

This is a good list to have in case you can't tell one way or the other.

:)

http://www.bobpark.com/Articles/SevenSigns.htm

Disclaimer: I am a fan of Bob Park.

Zz.

 

[Mattara]

Wonder if a website that has boring background color with poorly formatted text and problems with space and paragraphs could qualify as Voodoo Science?

 

[Astronuc]

That's a good article.

I remember the Pons and Fleischman Cold Fusion fiasco! Our department was besieged with media and investors/investment companies asking about the discovery, while the price of palladium and platinum soared.

My first thought was, what detection methods were used, what neutron energies were observed, and what did the neutron and gamma spectra look like. No data were provided, so I was skeptical. Meanwhile, scientist PhDs were conjecturing QM theories as to how "cold fusion" could have occurred, and some were trying to obtain patents on possible methods or processes.

 

[ZapperZ]

That's a good article.

I remember the Pons and Fleischman Cold Fusion fiasco! Our department was besieged with media and investors/investment companies asking about the discovery, while the price of palladium and platinum soared.

My first thought was, what detection methods were used, what neutron energies were observed, and what did the neutron and gamma spectra look like. No data were provided, so I was skeptical. Meanwhile, scientist PhDs were conjecturing QM theories as to how "cold fusion" could have occurred, and some were trying to obtain patents on possible methods or processes.

I have my own anecdote of the whole debacle.

When the whole story broke, I had just completed my Masters thesis research on adsorbed hydrogen on platinum catalyst. Now unlike palladium (which was the material Fleishman and Pons used) where the hydrogen was absorbed right into the bulk of the material, we found that hydrogen in platinum only tends to reside on the surface (thus the "adsorbed" part). This means that they are confined to within a certain thickness and thus, a greater likelyhood of bumping into one another.

I got contacted by someone who had a copy of the F&P manuscript that they had submitted to Nature (before it was rejected), gave me a copy of it, and asked if I would be interested in investigating the same thing but using Pt wires instead of Pd. Silly cow that was me said "No, I already had a job offer and not sure (at that time) if I wanted to continue in getting a Ph.D".

That was one of the few times that my impulsive reaction to something actually did me some good!

:)

Zz.

 

[Astronuc]

I should have gone out the day it was announced and bought contracts in Pd and Pt, and then sold them the next day.

What got me is the ridiculous conjectures as to how Pd could permit fusion at such low temperature. People were talking about the complete 4d level and how deuterons could get close enough. It was mind boggling what some people in the scientific community were theorizing.


BTW, I am a fan of James Randi.

http://www.randi.org/

http://www.skeptic.com/

 

[Doc Al]

Disclaimer: I am a fan of Bob Park.

No shame in that! Me too. I had the chance to meet him at a conference a couple of years ago; had a chat over breakfast and got him to sign my copy of Voodoo Science.

Great anecdote about cold fusion and P&F, Zz. I remember at that time getting a desk-to-desk memo all throughout the labs where I worked warning us in stern terms to not attempt to duplicate these experiments.

BTW, I am a fan of James Randi.

Me too! Gotta love him.

 

[ZapperZ]

No shame in that! Me too. I had the chance to meet him at a conference a couple of years ago; had a chat over breakfast and got him to sign my copy of Voodoo Science.

Drat! I am so jealous. He's the one guy I would like to sign his book. I had Leon Lederman autograph his book "The God Particles", but I think I'm going to put it on e-bay some time soon. :)

I was planning on meeting him one time at the APS March meeting when they announced that he was going to be there, but then he had a strange "encounter" with a falling tree, and that was that. :)

Great anecdote about cold fusion and P&F, Zz. I remember at that time getting a desk-to-desk memo all throughout the labs where I worked warning us in stern terms to not attempt to duplicate these experiments.

Hahahaha...

Zz.

 

[Astronuc]

Great anecdote about cold fusion and P&F, Zz. I remember at that time getting a desk-to-desk memo all throughout the labs where I worked warning us in stern terms to not attempt to duplicate these experiments.

Yeah, fortunately sanity prevailed for the most part , but not necessarily everywhere .

Boy was I in bad mood whenever people asked me about P&F and CF.

 

[Tzemach]

A great article with which I wholly agree. Even when you develop a "new" theory and start to do some research you find yourself working in the footsteps of those who have gone before. Your original concept has been examined and discarded and you are then working on the same Darned problem as a lot of other people.

The public at large is not involved enough to understand this and if we are realistic we have to admit even science has historically been a bit reluctant to accept change. Poor Galileo was forced to recant his heresy and admit that the Earth did not revolve around the Sun. The French Academy of Science prudently decreed in the 1700s that meteors were bunkum, not worthy of study or further discussion. “Rocks do not fall from the sky!” They changed their minds in 1803, following a meteor storm, which showered a village with meteorites.

In 1959 a survey of leading United States scientists included a question asking them to estimate the age of the universe. Two thirds of the scientists who replied said, “there is no age – the universe is eternal”. In a period of less than half a century the view that we live in a static eternal universe (a view which had persisted since the days of Plato and Aristotle) has been shown to be false.

We should not be complacent enough to think that we will all be smart enough to instantly recognise the next big breakthrough, even Einstein was viewed cautiously until it became evident that his calculations accurately described the various pheomena.

 

[Rach3]

Great anecdote about cold fusion and P&F, Zz. I remember at that time getting a desk-to-desk memo all throughout the labs where I worked warning us in stern terms to not attempt to duplicate these experiments.

I don't get it?

 

[russ_watters]

That's a good article.

Good book too - A lot of that is excerpted or paraphrased from it.

 

[Astronuc]

Park has a great disclaimer on his newsletter referenced in one thread by Zz.

Bob Park can be reached via email at whatsnew@bobpark.org

THE UNIVERSITY OF MARYLAND
"Opinions are the author's and are not necessarily shared by the University, but they should be."

D@#* right!

 

[Chi Meson]

Disclaimer: I am a fan of Bob Park.

I am also, as of now, a new fan. My students will be getting this read to them from now on!

and yeah, what's with the bad formatting?

 

[franznietzsche]

I preferred Sagain's 'The Demon Haunted World' personally.

 

[Doc Al]

I preferred Sagan's 'The Demon Haunted World' personally.

Another excellent book!

 

[Ivan Seeking]

BTW, I am a fan of James Randi.

That's a real shame. IMO, he can be as much of a crackpot as the people he debunks.

 

[Doc Al]

That's a real shame. IMO, he can be as much of a crackpot as the people he debunks.

You've made similar remarks before about Randi. Care to explain?

 

[Astronuc]

That's a real shame. IMO, he can be as much of a crackpot as the people he debunks.

Well someone has to do the debunking. Better him than me.

Note, I didn't say big fan, but I certainly appreciate his efforts, especially when it comes to religious fraud.

I don't expect Randi to be an expert in all areas scientific.

A lot of scientists have good comments/opinions about him - http://www.randi.org/jr/bio.html

 

[Curious3141]

That's a real shame. IMO, he can be as much of a crackpot as the people he debunks.

That's a rather sweeping statement to be making. In fact, in another thread, you were insisting Randi owes payouts to cortically blind people who could sense facially expressed emotions, claiming it was a paranormal phenomenon. I posted in that thread to explain why that obviously didn't qualify as anything approaching paranormalcy (is there such a word?).

You obviously have some biases against Randi. I'd like to give you the benefit of the doubt and believe that those biases must have arisen from justified negative impressions formed in the past. I am curious what turned you so strongly against him, though.

 

[ZapperZ]

Oh, you have GOT to read Bob Park's column this week if you haven't done so already - it's hysterical!

http://www.bobpark.org/

Zz.

 

[Astronuc]

After all, science-fiction writers have been stealing our themes for years, and portraying us as Dr. Strangeloves. And if we're the good guys, they get the physics wrong, like in Chain Reaction, where cold fusion works.

Maybe physicists and aerospace/nuclear engineers can file a class action suit asking for restraint orders against all sci/fi writers who misuse, misrepresent or otherwise abuse science.

As for PAT ROBERTSON and his prediction that "both coasts will be lashed by storms this year". Well yeah, that does happen from time to time - it's called weather.

As for the tsunami which 'might' hit the Pacific Northwest - well yes, one might some time between now and eternity. There is considerable seismic activity in the western Pacific along the Ring of Fire. All Pacific coast lines are at risk for tsunami. So far the Juan de Fuca and Pacific Plates have not had a significant vertical displacement event, but that could happen, and if it does, it will be a natural event. Similar, large vertical displacements on the intersections of the Phillipine and Australian plates with the Pacific plate would put the eastern coastlines of Asia and Australia, and the Western coastlines of North and South America at risk for tsunami. I believe the coastlines of the W. Pacific are more at risk in the near term.

Lighten up Pat!

 

[Doc Al]

Hilarious! Thanks, Zz.

 

[ZapperZ]

If you did not receive the recent APS News, there was a very nice column on Bob Park's retirement as the Director of APS Office of Public Affairs. But an exciting news that accompanied that was that Bob Park has signed a 2-book deal! If it is as good as Voodoo Science, I'm putting in my advance order with Amazon!

Zz.

 

[Doc Al]

Thanks, Zz. I did not hear about his retirement. Looking forward to the books. Bob Park kicks ass!

I hope he'll keep his "What's New" column going.

Note Added: Now I see the notice. (I must have been sleeping.) And I also see that What's New will continue. Yay!