[0,1] same cardinality as (0,1)

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In summary: That's a clever bijection, but I think there are simpler, more routine, ways. For instance, you could use the bijection f(x) = x/2+1/4 of [0,1] to [1/4, 3/4] ⊂ (0,1) to prove that the cardinality of [0,1] ≤ cardinality of (0,1) and clearly (0,1) ⊂ [0,1] so cardinality of (0,1) ≤ cardinality of [0,1]. Concluding that the cardinalities are equal. It's not as clever, but...In summary, the conversation discusses different approaches to proving that two sets
  • #1
Mr Davis 97
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To show that two sets have the same cardinality you have to show that there is a bijection between the two. Apparently, one bijection from [0,1] to (0,1) is ##
f(x) = \left\{
\begin{array}{lr}
1/2 & : x = 0\\
\frac{1}{n+2} & : x = \frac{1}{n}\\
x & : \text{any other value}
\end{array}
\right.
##

My question, if I were tasked with finding this bijection, how would I do it? It seems very non-obvious.
 
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  • #2
Good question. An approach I can think of is the following: We want to show that ##(0,1) \stackrel{1:1}{\longleftrightarrow} (0,1) \cup \{1,\ldots n\}##. Now we know that ##\{n+1,\ldots ,\infty\} \stackrel{1:1}{\longleftrightarrow} \{1,\ldots ,\infty\}## which can be done by shifting the values. To get them into ##[0,1]## isn't difficult, just take their reciprocal. So all what is left, is to put in the ##0## somewhere and define the rest to be constant.
 
  • #3
fresh_42 said:
Good question. An approach I can think of is the following: We want to show that ##(0,1) \stackrel{1:1}{\longleftrightarrow} (0,1) \cup \{1,\ldots n\}##. Now we know that ##\{n+1,\ldots ,\infty\} \stackrel{1:1}{\longleftrightarrow} \{1,\ldots ,\infty\}## which can be done by shifting the values. To get them into ##[0,1]## isn't difficult, just take their reciprocal. So all what is left, is to put in the ##0## somewhere and define the rest to be constant.
Why is ##
(0,1) \stackrel{1:1}{\longleftrightarrow} (0,1) \cup \{1,\ldots n\}
## what we want to show? How is the RHS the same as ##[0,1]##?
 
  • #4
Mr Davis 97 said:
Why is ##
(0,1) \stackrel{1:1}{\longleftrightarrow} (0,1) \cup \{1,\ldots n\}
## what we want to show? How is the RHS the same as ##[0,1]##?
I only wanted to say, that the cardinality of an infinite set won't be changed, if we add a finite number of points. This is slightly more general as the case we need, which is ##(0,1) \cup \{0,1\}=[0,1]## but basically the same principle. As we have to add ##2## elements, the shifting operation is ##n \mapsto n+2## to get space for the additional elements and which is the denominator of the sought bijection.
 
  • #5
How I would approach it: f(x)=x is good for most points, but we have to "hide" x=0 and x=1 somewhere.
There is a very easy bijection between {0,1,2,3,...} and {2,3,...}: g(n)=n+2. As you can see, the first set has two elements the other one has not but we found a bijection. We just have to find a similar set in (0,1). The reciprocal numbers are suitable.
Start with f(0)=1/2, f(1)=1/3. What about f(1/2)? Well, map it f(1/2)=1/4. Continue: f(1/3)=1/5 and f(1/4)=1/6 and so on. Written generally, this directly gives the bijection you have.

It is not the only one, but it is one with a very short notation.
 
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  • #6
mfb said:
How I would approach it: f(x)=x is good for most points, but we have to "hide" x=0 and x=1 somewhere.
There is a very easy bijection between {0,1,2,3,...} and {2,3,...}: g(n)=n+2. As you can see, the first set has two elements the other one has not but we found a bijection. We just have to find a similar set in (0,1). The reciprocal numbers are suitable.
Start with f(0)=1/2, f(1)=1/3. What about f(1/2)? Well, map it f(1/2)=1/4. Continue: f(1/3)=1/5 and f(1/4)=1/6 and so on. Written generally, this directly gives the bijection you have.

It is not the only one, but it is one with a very short notation.
I think it's clear to me now. One more questions: would the best way to show that this is a bijection be to find the inverse, or to show that it is surjective and injective?
 
  • #7
There is no "best" way. Both are reasonably short, but don't forget, that the inverse method needs both sides: ##f\circ f^{-1}= \operatorname{id}## and ##f^{-1} \circ f = \operatorname{id}##. Surjectivity is short, injectivity requires an argument, but isn't complicated either.
 
  • #8
I think perhaps one way might be to see how to create a bijection between (0,1] and (0,1). So, for example, we could have:
f(1) = 1/2
f(1/2) = 1/3
f(1/3) = 1/4
f(1/4) = 1/5
... and so on.
Apart from the values of the form 1/n where n ≥ 1, we would have f(x)=x.

I suppose post#5 is very similar. But I wanted to emphasize a bit (like mentioned in post#4) that adding any finite number of elements wouldn't change the cardinality of (0,1) because we could create more backward chains like the one mentioned above. But we would have to be careful that the backward chains remain completely separate from each other.

In fact, of course adding a countable infinity of elements wouldn't change the cardinality of (0,1) either (create a countable infinity of separate backward chains). For example adding a set A to (0,1) ... where A={1,2,3,4,5,...}.

==========

I was thinking, how about bijection between (0,1) and (0,∞). If we assuming a well-ordering of [0,1] (and hence also (0,1) ) is possible, then it is fairly easy to see a bijection.

If not, probably something like this should work I think:
create correspondence between (0,1/2] and (0,1]
creater correspondence between (1/2,3/4] and (1,2]
and so on shrinking the intervals further and further.

Though I am guessing this kind of construction would be routine for those familiar with solving problems of this kind.
 
  • #9
SSequence said:
I suppose post#5 is very similar. But I wanted to emphasize a bit (like mentioned in post#4) that adding any finite number of elements wouldn't change the cardinality of (0,1) because we could create more backward chains like the one mentioned above. But we would have to be careful that the backward chains remain completely separate from each other.
You can use the same chain for every countable number of elements. OP had an example for 2 elements.
This is related to Hilbert's hotel.
 
  • #10
That's a clever bijection, but I think there are simpler, more routine, ways. For instance, you could use the bijection f(x) = x/2+1/4 of [0,1] to [1/4, 3/4] ⊂ (0,1) to prove that the cardinality of [0,1] ≤ cardinality of (0,1) and clearly (0,1) ⊂ [0,1] so cardinality of (0,1) ≤ cardinality of [0,1]. Concluding that the cardinalities are equal. It's not as clever, but I think it gets the job done.
 
  • #11
mfb said:
You can use the same chain for every countable number of elements. OP had an example for 2 elements.
This is related to Hilbert's hotel.
I guess there would be pretty clever ways to write this kind of bijection so I didn't discount any other method in my wording (but I tried to keep it brief).

But specifically looking at OP's construction, I suppose it is just a little difference in meaning of chain? I plugged in some values from the function in OP. Here is how it goes:
f(0) = 1/2
f(1/2) = 1/4
f(1/4) = 1/6
f(1/6) = 1/8
and so on...

The way I was considering it, I was counting that as a chain. And then for second element plugging the values:
f(1) = 1/3
f(1/3) = 1/5
f(1/5) = 1/7
f(1/7) = 1/9
and so on...

The way I was using the word "chain", I was considering these as two separate chains. I suppose you were referring to chain roughly in the sense of set of values that had to be altered (or something similar).

Really doesn't matter much though I guess.
 

1. Is the interval [0,1] the same size as the interval (0,1)?

Yes, the interval [0,1] and (0,1) have the same cardinality, meaning they have the same number of elements, or in this case, the same number of real numbers between 0 and 1.

2. How can [0,1] and (0,1) have the same cardinality if [0,1] includes 0 and 1 while (0,1) does not?

Cardinality is not determined by the endpoints of an interval, but rather by the number of elements within the interval. Both [0,1] and (0,1) contain an infinite number of real numbers between 0 and 1, therefore they have the same cardinality.

3. Can you give an example of a one-to-one correspondence between [0,1] and (0,1)?

Yes, a one-to-one correspondence can be established by mapping each number x in [0,1] to the number 2x in (0,1). This means that for every number in [0,1], there is a unique corresponding number in (0,1) and vice versa.

4. What is the difference between the cardinality of [0,1] and (0,1)?

The cardinality of [0,1] and (0,1) is the same, but the intervals have different boundaries. [0,1] includes the endpoints 0 and 1, while (0,1) does not. This difference in endpoints does not affect the cardinality of the intervals.

5. Is it possible for an interval to have a different cardinality than [0,1] and (0,1)?

Yes, there are intervals that have different cardinality than [0,1] and (0,1). For example, the interval [0,2] has a larger cardinality than [0,1] and (0,1) because it includes all of the real numbers between 0 and 2, which is a larger set than the real numbers between 0 and 1.

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